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	<title>Comments on: Honest Debate, Politics, and Victory</title>
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	<description>Online Journal of Politics and Foreign Affairs</description>
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		<title>By: Bithead</title>
		<link>http://www.outsidethebeltway.com/archives/honest_debate_politics_and_victory/comment-page-1/#comment-118724</link>
		<dc:creator>Bithead</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 03 Apr 2007 02:42:12 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.outsidethebeltway.com/archives/2007/04/honest_debate_politics_and_victory/#comment-118724</guid>
		<description>Refused to properly from the war, Gracie?  
Just to do you think is in power, at the moment?</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Refused to properly from the war, Gracie?<br />
Just to do you think is in power, at the moment?</p>
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		<title>By: spencer</title>
		<link>http://www.outsidethebeltway.com/archives/honest_debate_politics_and_victory/comment-page-1/#comment-118703</link>
		<dc:creator>spencer</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 02 Apr 2007 22:43:54 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.outsidethebeltway.com/archives/2007/04/honest_debate_politics_and_victory/#comment-118703</guid>
		<description>I make no bones about it, I am an old fashion 1960s liberal.  I have no problem with going to war in Iraq to establish a client state and a military footprint in the mid east. I actually think it is a very good idea since Bush appeased Ben Laden by meeting his number one demand by pulling out troops out of Sandia Arabia -- and people wonder why there has not been a second attack on the US since 9/11.

What I have trouble with is losing that war because this administration thinks its tax cuts for the wealthy are more important then providing the military with the resources they need to win the war.

the people who are not supporting the troops are the republicans who insist on sending our troops to war without giving them the resources they need to win the war.

I challenge you to show me a single analysis that shows my position is incorrect.

Is is not the democrats who say end this war that are the traitors, it is the republicans who refuse to properly fund the war.  If the republican refuse to give the troops the resources they need to win, why shouldn&#039;t the democrats say to leave?</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I make no bones about it, I am an old fashion 1960s liberal.  I have no problem with going to war in Iraq to establish a client state and a military footprint in the mid east. I actually think it is a very good idea since Bush appeased Ben Laden by meeting his number one demand by pulling out troops out of Sandia Arabia -- and people wonder why there has not been a second attack on the US since 9/11.</p>
<p>What I have trouble with is losing that war because this administration thinks its tax cuts for the wealthy are more important then providing the military with the resources they need to win the war.</p>
<p>the people who are not supporting the troops are the republicans who insist on sending our troops to war without giving them the resources they need to win the war.</p>
<p>I challenge you to show me a single analysis that shows my position is incorrect.</p>
<p>Is is not the democrats who say end this war that are the traitors, it is the republicans who refuse to properly fund the war.  If the republican refuse to give the troops the resources they need to win, why shouldn't the democrats say to leave?</p>
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		<title>By: Jim Henley</title>
		<link>http://www.outsidethebeltway.com/archives/honest_debate_politics_and_victory/comment-page-1/#comment-118687</link>
		<dc:creator>Jim Henley</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 02 Apr 2007 21:25:00 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.outsidethebeltway.com/archives/2007/04/honest_debate_politics_and_victory/#comment-118687</guid>
		<description>&lt;blockquote&gt;Yet the question must be asked, how much of that image is the Democrat anti-war campaign come home to roost? I suspect rather a lot.&lt;/blockquote&gt;

No, that was me!

Sheesh.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<blockquote><p>Yet the question must be asked, how much of that image is the Democrat anti-war campaign come home to roost? I suspect rather a lot.</p></blockquote>
<p>No, that was me!</p>
<p>Sheesh.</p>
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		<title>By: Bithead</title>
		<link>http://www.outsidethebeltway.com/archives/honest_debate_politics_and_victory/comment-page-1/#comment-118678</link>
		<dc:creator>Bithead</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 02 Apr 2007 20:43:42 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.outsidethebeltway.com/archives/2007/04/honest_debate_politics_and_victory/#comment-118678</guid>
		<description>I suppose it all a matter of degree, frankly. But we none of us are virgins, in the end. I&#039;ve always held that there are no objective observers. An impartial press is an impossibility on the scale of freeze-dried water.

Then again, neither you or I have laid claim to impartiality.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I suppose it all a matter of degree, frankly. But we none of us are virgins, in the end. I've always held that there are no objective observers. An impartial press is an impossibility on the scale of freeze-dried water.</p>
<p>Then again, neither you or I have laid claim to impartiality.</p>
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		<title>By: James Joyner</title>
		<link>http://www.outsidethebeltway.com/archives/honest_debate_politics_and_victory/comment-page-1/#comment-118633</link>
		<dc:creator>James Joyner</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 02 Apr 2007 17:11:38 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.outsidethebeltway.com/archives/2007/04/honest_debate_politics_and_victory/#comment-118633</guid>
		<description>&lt;em&gt;You’re already an activist for your own POV thereby.&lt;/em&gt;

Sure. But it&#039;s a far cry from that to using one&#039;s forum as a fundraising platform and otherwise using it to advance political goals.  It&#039;s not so much about charges of &quot;bias&quot; but about conflicting interests.

As an analyst, I&#039;m free to support Bush over Kerry for president while at the same time criticizing Bush policies or pointing out that specific charges against Kerry are unfair.  As an activist, those roles conflict.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p><em>You&rsquo;re already an activist for your own POV thereby.</em></p>
<p>Sure. But it's a far cry from that to using one's forum as a fundraising platform and otherwise using it to advance political goals.  It's not so much about charges of "bias" but about conflicting interests.</p>
<p>As an analyst, I'm free to support Bush over Kerry for president while at the same time criticizing Bush policies or pointing out that specific charges against Kerry are unfair.  As an activist, those roles conflict.</p>
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		<title>By: Bithead</title>
		<link>http://www.outsidethebeltway.com/archives/honest_debate_politics_and_victory/comment-page-1/#comment-118619</link>
		<dc:creator>Bithead</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 02 Apr 2007 16:20:06 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.outsidethebeltway.com/archives/2007/04/honest_debate_politics_and_victory/#comment-118619</guid>
		<description>Hmmm. First one didn&#039;t go. No idea why.

Look; the very definition of Pundit involves the renering of your opinion. You&#039;re already an activist for your own POV thereby. On taht basis you could eb called biased if you happen to agree with one candidate or another.... even if you didn&#039;t particularly support said candidate</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Hmmm. First one didn't go. No idea why.</p>
<p>Look; the very definition of Pundit involves the renering of your opinion. You're already an activist for your own POV thereby. On taht basis you could eb called biased if you happen to agree with one candidate or another.... even if you didn't particularly support said candidate</p>
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		<title>By: Bithead</title>
		<link>http://www.outsidethebeltway.com/archives/honest_debate_politics_and_victory/comment-page-1/#comment-118612</link>
		<dc:creator>Bithead</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 02 Apr 2007 15:32:41 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.outsidethebeltway.com/archives/2007/04/honest_debate_politics_and_victory/#comment-118612</guid>
		<description>&lt;blockquote&gt;Plenty of analysts I respect, including Barnett, think it’s time to pull the plug on the war. That’s a perfectly legitimate position to have. Indeed, four years into the effort with little sign of impending victory, it’s not surprising that the consensus desire of the American public is for it all to be over with.&lt;/blockquote&gt;

Yet the question must be asked, how much of that image is the Democrat anti-war campaign come home to roost? I suspect rather a lot.

&lt;blockquote&gt;I’m generally leery of moving from punditry to activism;&lt;/blockquote&gt;

(Sigh) Since we seem to be dancing on the head of a definition....

&lt;a href=&quot;http://dictionary.reference.com/browse/punditry&quot; rel=&quot;nofollow&quot;&gt;pun·dit·ry&lt;/a&gt;      /ˈpʌndɪtri/ Pronunciation Key - Show Spelled Pronunciation[puhn-di-tree] Pronunciation Key - Show IPA Pronunciation 
–noun the opinions or methods of pundits.  


&lt;blockquote&gt;--------------------------------------------------------------------------------

[Origin: 1925–30; pundit + -ry] 
Dictionary.com Unabridged (v 1.1)
Based on the Random House Unabridged Dictionary, © Random House, Inc. 2006. 
American Heritage Dictionary - Cite This Source pun·dit       (pŭn&#039;dĭt)  Pronunciation Key  
n.   
A source of opinion; a critic: a political pundit. 
A learned person. 
Hinduism Variant of pandit.&lt;/blockquote&gt;  


So, if you engage in Punditry, you&#039;re expressing and arging for your opinion, even if you&#039;ve not FORMED an opinion yet. Once you DO form an opinion, and express it and argue for it, you&#039;ve already made the transition to activism for your own POV.

Now, if that POV happens to go along with one candidate or the other...</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<blockquote><p>Plenty of analysts I respect, including Barnett, think it&rsquo;s time to pull the plug on the war. That&rsquo;s a perfectly legitimate position to have. Indeed, four years into the effort with little sign of impending victory, it&rsquo;s not surprising that the consensus desire of the American public is for it all to be over with.</p></blockquote>
<p>Yet the question must be asked, how much of that image is the Democrat anti-war campaign come home to roost? I suspect rather a lot.</p>
<blockquote><p>I&rsquo;m generally leery of moving from punditry to activism;</p></blockquote>
<p>(Sigh) Since we seem to be dancing on the head of a definition....</p>
<p><a href="http://dictionary.reference.com/browse/punditry" rel="nofollow">pun·dit·ry</a>      /ˈpʌndɪtri/ Pronunciation Key - Show Spelled Pronunciation[puhn-di-tree] Pronunciation Key - Show IPA Pronunciation<br />
–noun the opinions or methods of pundits.  </p>
<blockquote><p>--------------------------------------------------------------------------------</p>
<p>[Origin: 1925–30; pundit + -ry]<br />
Dictionary.com Unabridged (v 1.1)<br />
Based on the Random House Unabridged Dictionary, © Random House, Inc. 2006.<br />
American Heritage Dictionary - Cite This Source pun·dit       (pŭn'dĭt)  Pronunciation Key<br />
n.<br />
A source of opinion; a critic: a political pundit.<br />
A learned person.<br />
Hinduism Variant of pandit.</p></blockquote>
<p>So, if you engage in Punditry, you're expressing and arging for your opinion, even if you've not FORMED an opinion yet. Once you DO form an opinion, and express it and argue for it, you've already made the transition to activism for your own POV.</p>
<p>Now, if that POV happens to go along with one candidate or the other...</p>
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		<title>By: Anon</title>
		<link>http://www.outsidethebeltway.com/archives/honest_debate_politics_and_victory/comment-page-1/#comment-118610</link>
		<dc:creator>Anon</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 02 Apr 2007 15:19:07 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.outsidethebeltway.com/archives/2007/04/honest_debate_politics_and_victory/#comment-118610</guid>
		<description>Maybe a group of bloggers should sign a joint declaration, along the lines of:

&lt;blockquote&gt;I am a conservative/Republican, but:

I do not think you are a traitor if you oppose the Iraq war,
I do not think you hate America when you criticize the Bush administration,
...etc.

I am a liberal/Democrat, but:

I do not think you are a baby-killer if you favor the Iraq war,
I do not think you own Halliburton stock if you support the Bush administration,
I do not think you are a racist if you oppose affirmative action,
...etc.

&lt;/blockquote&gt;</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Maybe a group of bloggers should sign a joint declaration, along the lines of:</p>
<blockquote><p>I am a conservative/Republican, but:</p>
<p>I do not think you are a traitor if you oppose the Iraq war,<br />
I do not think you hate America when you criticize the Bush administration,<br />
...etc.</p>
<p>I am a liberal/Democrat, but:</p>
<p>I do not think you are a baby-killer if you favor the Iraq war,<br />
I do not think you own Halliburton stock if you support the Bush administration,<br />
I do not think you are a racist if you oppose affirmative action,<br />
...etc.</p>
</blockquote>
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		<title>By: charles austin</title>
		<link>http://www.outsidethebeltway.com/archives/honest_debate_politics_and_victory/comment-page-1/#comment-118599</link>
		<dc:creator>charles austin</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 02 Apr 2007 14:31:30 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.outsidethebeltway.com/archives/2007/04/honest_debate_politics_and_victory/#comment-118599</guid>
		<description>This also reflects many of the problems with most polls as they relate to the Bush administration and Iraq.  My friends on the anti-war (using their preferred term) side of the street should realize that just because I&#039;m unhappy with Bush or the conduct of the war in Iraq it does not follow that I agree with you.  

&quot;In it to win it,&quot; seems like such a catchy phrase when Senators Clinton and Obama use it.  Surely it must apply at least equally well with Iraq.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>This also reflects many of the problems with most polls as they relate to the Bush administration and Iraq.  My friends on the anti-war (using their preferred term) side of the street should realize that just because I'm unhappy with Bush or the conduct of the war in Iraq it does not follow that I agree with you.  </p>
<p>"In it to win it," seems like such a catchy phrase when Senators Clinton and Obama use it.  Surely it must apply at least equally well with Iraq.</p>
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		<title>By: Thomas P.M. Barnett :: Weblog</title>
		<link>http://www.outsidethebeltway.com/archives/honest_debate_politics_and_victory/comment-page-1/#comment-126606</link>
		<dc:creator>Thomas P.M. Barnett :: Weblog</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 31 Dec 1969 18:00:00 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.outsidethebeltway.com/archives/2007/04/honest_debate_politics_and_victory/#comment-126606</guid>
		<description>&lt;!--%kramer-pre%--&gt;Heritage Tidbits. + postpolitical linked My “a-ha” on the Settling the West analogy/metaphor. + Nick Guariglia mentioned Tom and the SysAdmin. + Dave Porter promotes learning Chinese, with Tom as inspiration. + Outside the Beltway linked Bush&#039;s post-presidency means we all move on. +  Ben and Faye&#039;s Eurasian Adventure mention Tom and his position on China. +  Live from Zion says PNM is amazing. +  Civil War Bookshelf thinks this weblog is &#039;frivolous to the point of being&lt;!--%kramer-post%--&gt;</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p><!--%kramer-pre%-->Heritage Tidbits. + postpolitical linked My “a-ha” on the Settling the West analogy/metaphor. + Nick Guariglia mentioned Tom and the SysAdmin. + Dave Porter promotes learning Chinese, with Tom as inspiration. + Outside the Beltway linked Bush's post-presidency means we all move on. +  Ben and Faye's Eurasian Adventure mention Tom and his position on China. +  Live from Zion says PNM is amazing. +  Civil War Bookshelf thinks this weblog is 'frivolous to the point of being<!--%kramer-post%--></p>
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		<title>By:  » OTB News</title>
		<link>http://www.outsidethebeltway.com/archives/honest_debate_politics_and_victory/comment-page-1/#comment-126607</link>
		<dc:creator> » OTB News</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 31 Dec 1969 18:00:00 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.outsidethebeltway.com/archives/2007/04/honest_debate_politics_and_victory/#comment-126607</guid>
		<description>&lt;!--%kramer-pre%--&gt;Did General Petraeus Snub Congressional Democrats? Beltway Traffic Jam Instant Communication Destroying Battlefield Morale? Our Bombers Are Awesome, So Let’s Replace Them Supreme Court Denies Gitmo Habeas Appeals 10 Reasons You Aren’t Rich Honest Debate, Politics, and Victory Grading Presidential Candidate Videos  [IMG OTB Sports]  2007 Predictions: Award and Standings Tampa Bay Buccaneers LB Derrick Brooks to chair Physical Fitness committee Phil Jackson and Roy Williams Elected to Hall of Fame&lt;!--%kramer-post%--&gt;</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p><!--%kramer-pre%-->Did General Petraeus Snub Congressional Democrats? Beltway Traffic Jam Instant Communication Destroying Battlefield Morale? Our Bombers Are Awesome, So Let&rsquo;s Replace Them Supreme Court Denies Gitmo Habeas Appeals 10 Reasons You Aren&rsquo;t Rich Honest Debate, Politics, and Victory Grading Presidential Candidate Videos  [IMG OTB Sports]  2007 Predictions: Award and Standings Tampa Bay Buccaneers LB Derrick Brooks to chair Physical Fitness committee Phil Jackson and Roy Williams Elected to Hall of Fame<!--%kramer-post%--></p>
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