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	<title>Comments on: Majority Oppose Supplemental Spending Shenanigans</title>
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	<link>http://www.outsidethebeltway.com/archives/majority_oppose_supplemental_spending_shenanigans/</link>
	<description>Online Journal of Politics and Foreign Affairs</description>
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		<title>By: Brian Hines</title>
		<link>http://www.outsidethebeltway.com/archives/majority_oppose_supplemental_spending_shenanigans/comment-page-1/#comment-118346</link>
		<dc:creator>Brian Hines</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 30 Mar 2007 15:49:22 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.outsidethebeltway.com/archives/2007/03/majority_oppose_/#comment-118346</guid>
		<description>I&#039;m guessing this poll was prematurely shut down.  Once the people being polled found out that this poll didn&#039;t skew heavily to the left, they either died of shock or hung up so they could gather food for the end of the world.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I'm guessing this poll was prematurely shut down.  Once the people being polled found out that this poll didn't skew heavily to the left, they either died of shock or hung up so they could gather food for the end of the world.</p>
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		<title>By: Keith, Indy</title>
		<link>http://www.outsidethebeltway.com/archives/majority_oppose_supplemental_spending_shenanigans/comment-page-1/#comment-118342</link>
		<dc:creator>Keith, Indy</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 30 Mar 2007 15:29:20 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.outsidethebeltway.com/archives/2007/03/majority_oppose_/#comment-118342</guid>
		<description>&lt;blockquote&gt;Bush doesn’t include the war in the usual spending bill because he wants to be able to claim to have a “balanced budget” by keeping the huge war expense off the books.&lt;/blockquote&gt;

&lt;blockquote&gt;There is no doubt that Bush is using voodoo economics &amp; playing politics by putting expenses for the war into a supplemental bill.&lt;/blockquote&gt;

Actually, you guys are wrong about the facts on this.

The way the war is being paid for, through supplementals, has been the way wars and emergencies  are paid for, for some time.  Doesn&#039;t make it the best way to do it, but it&#039;s not like this is some new phenomenon or scheme...

See &lt;a href=&quot;http://www.dod.gov/execsec/adr95/budget_5.html&quot; rel=&quot;nofollow&quot;&gt;this&lt;/a&gt; as an example:

&lt;blockquote&gt;None of the $25 billion from the President is aimed at covering DoD&#039;s unbudgeted spending for ongoing contingency operations, primarily in Haiti, Bosnia, and Southwest Asia. To cover those incremental costs, an FY 1995 emergency supplemental appropriations request is being forwarded to Congress at about the same time as the President&#039;s budget.&lt;/blockquote&gt;

If you want this to change, we should push Congress into changing the laws and rules for appropriations.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<blockquote><p>Bush doesn&rsquo;t include the war in the usual spending bill because he wants to be able to claim to have a “balanced budget” by keeping the huge war expense off the books.</p></blockquote>
<blockquote><p>There is no doubt that Bush is using voodoo economics &amp; playing politics by putting expenses for the war into a supplemental bill.</p></blockquote>
<p>Actually, you guys are wrong about the facts on this.</p>
<p>The way the war is being paid for, through supplementals, has been the way wars and emergencies  are paid for, for some time.  Doesn't make it the best way to do it, but it's not like this is some new phenomenon or scheme...</p>
<p>See <a href="http://www.dod.gov/execsec/adr95/budget_5.html" rel="nofollow">this</a> as an example:</p>
<blockquote><p>None of the $25 billion from the President is aimed at covering DoD's unbudgeted spending for ongoing contingency operations, primarily in Haiti, Bosnia, and Southwest Asia. To cover those incremental costs, an FY 1995 emergency supplemental appropriations request is being forwarded to Congress at about the same time as the President's budget.</p></blockquote>
<p>If you want this to change, we should push Congress into changing the laws and rules for appropriations.</p>
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		<title>By: Pajamas Media</title>
		<link>http://www.outsidethebeltway.com/archives/majority_oppose_supplemental_spending_shenanigans/comment-page-1/#comment-118341</link>
		<dc:creator>Pajamas Media</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 30 Mar 2007 15:04:11 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.outsidethebeltway.com/archives/2007/03/majority_oppose_/#comment-118341</guid>
		<description>&lt;strong&gt;Majority Opposed to the Provisions of the Iraq War Supplemental Spending Bill...&lt;/strong&gt;

(POS poll via Outside the Beltway)......</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p><strong>Majority Opposed to the Provisions of the Iraq War Supplemental Spending Bill...</strong></p>
<p>(POS poll via Outside the Beltway)......</p>
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		<title>By: paul a'barge</title>
		<link>http://www.outsidethebeltway.com/archives/majority_oppose_supplemental_spending_shenanigans/comment-page-1/#comment-118336</link>
		<dc:creator>paul a'barge</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 30 Mar 2007 14:25:57 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.outsidethebeltway.com/archives/2007/03/majority_oppose_/#comment-118336</guid>
		<description>Think back. Remember the &quot;shut down the federal government&quot; incident, in which Newt and Congress were held responsible instead of Clinton.

That&#039;s what this poll is about. The Republican party is not going to repeat the past. They&#039;re going to make perfectly clear who is going to take the hit when funding for our military stops, and thankfully, this time it&#039;s Congress and the DHIMMIcRATs.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Think back. Remember the "shut down the federal government" incident, in which Newt and Congress were held responsible instead of Clinton.</p>
<p>That's what this poll is about. The Republican party is not going to repeat the past. They're going to make perfectly clear who is going to take the hit when funding for our military stops, and thankfully, this time it's Congress and the DHIMMIcRATs.</p>
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		<title>By: James Joyner</title>
		<link>http://www.outsidethebeltway.com/archives/majority_oppose_supplemental_spending_shenanigans/comment-page-1/#comment-118326</link>
		<dc:creator>James Joyner</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 30 Mar 2007 12:12:09 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.outsidethebeltway.com/archives/2007/03/majority_oppose_/#comment-118326</guid>
		<description>&lt;em&gt;polling done by JJ&#039;s wife&lt;/em&gt;

Actually, she does pretty much everything but polling for POS.  She runs HR, IT, and ops.  She does occasionally run some &quot;dial groups&quot; (focus groups for commercials and the like) but isn&#039;t involved in selling polls or creating the questions.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p><em>polling done by JJ's wife</em></p>
<p>Actually, she does pretty much everything but polling for POS.  She runs HR, IT, and ops.  She does occasionally run some "dial groups" (focus groups for commercials and the like) but isn't involved in selling polls or creating the questions.</p>
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		<title>By: bob in fl</title>
		<link>http://www.outsidethebeltway.com/archives/majority_oppose_supplemental_spending_shenanigans/comment-page-1/#comment-118315</link>
		<dc:creator>bob in fl</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 30 Mar 2007 05:40:57 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.outsidethebeltway.com/archives/2007/03/majority_oppose_/#comment-118315</guid>
		<description>And Duncan Hunter is just full of it. Nuff said.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>And Duncan Hunter is just full of it. Nuff said.</p>
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		<title>By: bob in fl</title>
		<link>http://www.outsidethebeltway.com/archives/majority_oppose_supplemental_spending_shenanigans/comment-page-1/#comment-118314</link>
		<dc:creator>bob in fl</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 30 Mar 2007 05:39:31 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.outsidethebeltway.com/archives/2007/03/majority_oppose_/#comment-118314</guid>
		<description>I am part of the majority all the way in 1 &amp; 2.

On to #3. There is already a time limit on combat troops in Iraq - January 2009 or before Afghanistan implodes. The Iraqis are aware of that &amp; making a start on getting their shit together. 

There is no doubt that Bush is using voodoo economics &amp; playing politics by putting expenses for the war into a supplemental bill. The Dems are also playing politics. If Congress goes home without without a bill that Bush will sign, then I blame both sides. It is past time for both Congress &amp; Bush to get bi-pattisan. &amp; pass the supplemental spending bill on its own. The money issue will come up within a year anyway. Lets give the people on the ground what they need now &amp; argue the rest later. 

A final thought. General Washington &amp; President Lincoln were both losing their wars when Congress played politics, yet eventually won when given the chance. Bush is neither, &amp; winning outright is not possible. But giving international diplomacy time to work might create an outcome where nobody has to lose it all.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I am part of the majority all the way in 1 &amp; 2.</p>
<p>On to #3. There is already a time limit on combat troops in Iraq - January 2009 or before Afghanistan implodes. The Iraqis are aware of that &amp; making a start on getting their shit together. </p>
<p>There is no doubt that Bush is using voodoo economics &amp; playing politics by putting expenses for the war into a supplemental bill. The Dems are also playing politics. If Congress goes home without without a bill that Bush will sign, then I blame both sides. It is past time for both Congress &amp; Bush to get bi-pattisan. &amp; pass the supplemental spending bill on its own. The money issue will come up within a year anyway. Lets give the people on the ground what they need now &amp; argue the rest later. </p>
<p>A final thought. General Washington &amp; President Lincoln were both losing their wars when Congress played politics, yet eventually won when given the chance. Bush is neither, &amp; winning outright is not possible. But giving international diplomacy time to work might create an outcome where nobody has to lose it all.</p>
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		<title>By: Anderson</title>
		<link>http://www.outsidethebeltway.com/archives/majority_oppose_supplemental_spending_shenanigans/comment-page-1/#comment-118283</link>
		<dc:creator>Anderson</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 29 Mar 2007 22:51:24 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.outsidethebeltway.com/archives/2007/03/majority_oppose_/#comment-118283</guid>
		<description>I&#039;m not real comfy criticizing polling done by JJ&#039;s wife, so I will completely change the subject, and just say:

&lt;a href=&quot;http://news.yahoo.com/s/nm/20070329/ts_nm/guantanamo_gates_dc&quot; rel=&quot;nofollow&quot;&gt;Duncan Hunter is a jerk&lt;/a&gt;.

&lt;i&gt;But Rep. Duncan Hunter, a California Republican, said a memo circulated among members of another committee showed Democrats were considering relocating Guantanamo suspects to &lt;strong&gt;military jails&lt;/strong&gt; in more than a dozen different American communities, from Kansas&#039; Fort Leavenworth to Kentucky&#039;s Fort Knox.

&quot;I am very distressed,&quot; Hunter declared during a hearing of the House Armed Services Committee on the future of Guantanamo. He is the top Republican on that committee and a presidential hopeful as well.

&quot;The idea that we would &lt;strong&gt;import dangerous terrorists, like Khalid Sheikh Mohammed, into American communities&lt;/strong&gt; is dangerous,&quot; Hunter said, referring to the al Qaeda suspect who claims to have organized the September 11 attacks on the United States.&lt;/i&gt;

Because locking someone up in Leavenworth is placing him in an &quot;American community.&quot;</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I'm not real comfy criticizing polling done by JJ's wife, so I will completely change the subject, and just say:</p>
<p><a href="http://news.yahoo.com/s/nm/20070329/ts_nm/guantanamo_gates_dc" rel="nofollow">Duncan Hunter is a jerk</a>.</p>
<p><i>But Rep. Duncan Hunter, a California Republican, said a memo circulated among members of another committee showed Democrats were considering relocating Guantanamo suspects to <strong>military jails</strong> in more than a dozen different American communities, from Kansas' Fort Leavenworth to Kentucky's Fort Knox.</p>
<p>"I am very distressed," Hunter declared during a hearing of the House Armed Services Committee on the future of Guantanamo. He is the top Republican on that committee and a presidential hopeful as well.</p>
<p>"The idea that we would <strong>import dangerous terrorists, like Khalid Sheikh Mohammed, into American communities</strong> is dangerous," Hunter said, referring to the al Qaeda suspect who claims to have organized the September 11 attacks on the United States.</i></p>
<p>Because locking someone up in Leavenworth is placing him in an "American community."</p>
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		<title>By: Zelsdorf Ragshaft III</title>
		<link>http://www.outsidethebeltway.com/archives/majority_oppose_supplemental_spending_shenanigans/comment-page-1/#comment-118273</link>
		<dc:creator>Zelsdorf Ragshaft III</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 29 Mar 2007 21:57:26 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.outsidethebeltway.com/archives/2007/03/majority_oppose_/#comment-118273</guid>
		<description>I invite the communists on this post, Anjin, tanto, to have someone read the Constitution to them as it is obvious they either have not read or cannot read the document.  Congress has the power to either fund or not fund a conflict.  That is all.  There is no Congressional over site authorized by the Constitution on this matter.  The President of the United States is commander in chief of the military.  Lest you with very short memories forget, Bush beat the antiwar candidate in the last Presidential election.  You guys have a real problem with rules.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I invite the communists on this post, Anjin, tanto, to have someone read the Constitution to them as it is obvious they either have not read or cannot read the document.  Congress has the power to either fund or not fund a conflict.  That is all.  There is no Congressional over site authorized by the Constitution on this matter.  The President of the United States is commander in chief of the military.  Lest you with very short memories forget, Bush beat the antiwar candidate in the last Presidential election.  You guys have a real problem with rules.</p>
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		<title>By: yetanotherjohn</title>
		<link>http://www.outsidethebeltway.com/archives/majority_oppose_supplemental_spending_shenanigans/comment-page-1/#comment-118272</link>
		<dc:creator>yetanotherjohn</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 29 Mar 2007 21:47:20 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.outsidethebeltway.com/archives/2007/03/majority_oppose_/#comment-118272</guid>
		<description>Tano,

I freely admit that the RNC is going to spin this. But are you seriously suggesting that the democrats aren&#039;t trying just as hard to spin this?

Let&#039;s put this a different way. What is to keep congress (other than the fact they are congress) to pass a &#039;clean&#039; funding bill with no pork or withdrawal date. Then to either say that they will do the monitoring they describe and if the conditions aren&#039;t met, they will a) cut off funding, b) vote to revoke the AUMF or whatever.

The answer is that they are trying to spin this by combining the funding with the withdrawal. While I agree that it would be nice if PR spinning wasn&#039;t being applied to the serious subject of the war, I think you can take your pick as to the dems or GOP being the kettle or the pot on spin.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Tano,</p>
<p>I freely admit that the RNC is going to spin this. But are you seriously suggesting that the democrats aren't trying just as hard to spin this?</p>
<p>Let's put this a different way. What is to keep congress (other than the fact they are congress) to pass a 'clean' funding bill with no pork or withdrawal date. Then to either say that they will do the monitoring they describe and if the conditions aren't met, they will a) cut off funding, b) vote to revoke the AUMF or whatever.</p>
<p>The answer is that they are trying to spin this by combining the funding with the withdrawal. While I agree that it would be nice if PR spinning wasn't being applied to the serious subject of the war, I think you can take your pick as to the dems or GOP being the kettle or the pot on spin.</p>
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		<title>By: jeff b</title>
		<link>http://www.outsidethebeltway.com/archives/majority_oppose_supplemental_spending_shenanigans/comment-page-1/#comment-118269</link>
		<dc:creator>jeff b</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 29 Mar 2007 21:35:51 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.outsidethebeltway.com/archives/2007/03/majority_oppose_/#comment-118269</guid>
		<description>Can we quickly recap the situation?  Bush doesn&#039;t include the war in the usual spending bill because he wants to be able to claim to have a &quot;balanced budget&quot; by keeping the huge war expense off the books.  Therefore he requires this &quot;supplemental&quot; spending measure in order to fund the war.  By cutting this one expense out of the herd, Bush has made it vulnerable to exactly the kind of conditional approval that came to pass: the legislature added terms and conditions to the money.  It is a major tactical error on the part of the Executive, but it&#039;s understandable that they don&#039;t have any practice working with a real legislative branch.

If Bush had included the war in the main budget, this would not have happened because the majority would not risk a total government shutdown.  But then the White House would have lost the illusion that their budget is balanced.  When Bush vetoes the supplemental it&#039;s going to read very badly in the papers: Bush Vetoes War Spending or something along those lines.  It will appear that Bush&#039;s second veto &lt;em&gt;ever&lt;/em&gt; was used to derail the war, put the troops in danger, etc etc etc.

Bush went up against a hostile legislature for the first time in his sad little executive career, and he appears to be losing.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Can we quickly recap the situation?  Bush doesn't include the war in the usual spending bill because he wants to be able to claim to have a "balanced budget" by keeping the huge war expense off the books.  Therefore he requires this "supplemental" spending measure in order to fund the war.  By cutting this one expense out of the herd, Bush has made it vulnerable to exactly the kind of conditional approval that came to pass: the legislature added terms and conditions to the money.  It is a major tactical error on the part of the Executive, but it's understandable that they don't have any practice working with a real legislative branch.</p>
<p>If Bush had included the war in the main budget, this would not have happened because the majority would not risk a total government shutdown.  But then the White House would have lost the illusion that their budget is balanced.  When Bush vetoes the supplemental it's going to read very badly in the papers: Bush Vetoes War Spending or something along those lines.  It will appear that Bush's second veto <em>ever</em> was used to derail the war, put the troops in danger, etc etc etc.</p>
<p>Bush went up against a hostile legislature for the first time in his sad little executive career, and he appears to be losing.</p>
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		<title>By: Wayne</title>
		<link>http://www.outsidethebeltway.com/archives/majority_oppose_supplemental_spending_shenanigans/comment-page-1/#comment-118268</link>
		<dc:creator>Wayne</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 29 Mar 2007 21:30:50 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.outsidethebeltway.com/archives/2007/03/majority_oppose_/#comment-118268</guid>
		<description>Lets pass a law that says military supplemental can only contain military related spending and give the President a line item veto for this one bill.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Lets pass a law that says military supplemental can only contain military related spending and give the President a line item veto for this one bill.</p>
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		<title>By: Tano</title>
		<link>http://www.outsidethebeltway.com/archives/majority_oppose_supplemental_spending_shenanigans/comment-page-1/#comment-118261</link>
		<dc:creator>Tano</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 29 Mar 2007 21:02:30 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.outsidethebeltway.com/archives/2007/03/majority_oppose_/#comment-118261</guid>
		<description>Thanks for this insight into Republican spin operations. This is exactly why people detest politicians. Instead of dealing with reality and trying to develop sane policies, the focus is on crafting a PR message, a framing, that can elicit temporary &quot;support&quot;, while marching further down the road that the people really dont want to go.

I guess it is the only hope for Republicans.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Thanks for this insight into Republican spin operations. This is exactly why people detest politicians. Instead of dealing with reality and trying to develop sane policies, the focus is on crafting a PR message, a framing, that can elicit temporary "support", while marching further down the road that the people really dont want to go.</p>
<p>I guess it is the only hope for Republicans.</p>
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		<title>By: daryl smith</title>
		<link>http://www.outsidethebeltway.com/archives/majority_oppose_supplemental_spending_shenanigans/comment-page-1/#comment-118259</link>
		<dc:creator>daryl smith</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 29 Mar 2007 20:49:55 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.outsidethebeltway.com/archives/2007/03/majority_oppose_/#comment-118259</guid>
		<description>Republicans is seems will never learn you can lie your way to political oblivion as easily as tax and spend your way to the same fate.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Republicans is seems will never learn you can lie your way to political oblivion as easily as tax and spend your way to the same fate.</p>
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		<title>By: Anjin-San</title>
		<link>http://www.outsidethebeltway.com/archives/majority_oppose_supplemental_spending_shenanigans/comment-page-1/#comment-118256</link>
		<dc:creator>Anjin-San</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 29 Mar 2007 20:36:16 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.outsidethebeltway.com/archives/2007/03/majority_oppose_/#comment-118256</guid>
		<description>James,

While we are on the topic, perhaps you could (or some of your readers) look back and see if there was any pork in bills funding the war in the years when the GOP controlled congress. If it turns out there was none (somehow I doubt this) I will happily admit the Democrats are out of line and call Speaker Pelosi&#039;s office to express this view.

If it turns out that the GOP has a history of including pork in its war funding bills, will you admit the GOP is now playing politics with the lives of the troops?

Regards,

Anjin-San</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>James,</p>
<p>While we are on the topic, perhaps you could (or some of your readers) look back and see if there was any pork in bills funding the war in the years when the GOP controlled congress. If it turns out there was none (somehow I doubt this) I will happily admit the Democrats are out of line and call Speaker Pelosi's office to express this view.</p>
<p>If it turns out that the GOP has a history of including pork in its war funding bills, will you admit the GOP is now playing politics with the lives of the troops?</p>
<p>Regards,</p>
<p>Anjin-San</p>
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