Comments on: Marine Recruit Jason Robert Tharp Drowns

By: Ceegup

Ceegup — Fri, 04 Mar 2005 00:07:47 +0000

For someone to bring up the idea of suicide is just plain heartless. There has been nothing to insinuate that. This story is not an attack on the Marine Corp. It's about recruit,Jason Tharp, and specific DI's. Without the video, Jason's drowning would have been dismissed and his parents would probably not have gotten much of an answer to their question of how this could have happened. They deserve that answer.

By: tcox

tcox — Thu, 03 Mar 2005 20:32:59 +0000

My heart goes out to the family of Jason Tharp. I was sickened when I watched that footage, I cried for days and the images still haunt me. I also watched an interview of his parents and during the interview they read one of his letters. He indicated that he had been in the infirmary for a few days, so he was obviously very ill. In retrospect when I recall the footage I really think he looked ill, his face was pale and he was shaky on his feet. If in fact he was really ill, then maybe this contributed to his drowning, maybe he suffered a cardiac arrest during the exercise. I really hope the family get answers soon from the military. I think of my own sons and can only imagine their loss.

By: LCpl Ski

LCpl Ski — Thu, 03 Mar 2005 18:52:34 +0000

I too was surprised about the drowning. From my experience at that same exact pool, I don't think anything short of intentional suicide can cause drowning; though it is possible a mistake was made. But a few folks seem to be under the impression that the recruit drowned because the DIs were pushing him too hard... I call BS. When it comes to dangerous things like the pool, the DIs are more concerned for your safety than you are. If the recruit met his limit at the pool, he would have been pulled out and recycled. I know I was punished for not grabbing a buoy that was trhown to me because I looked like I was struggling a little bit. As far as striking the young man, we don't know the whole story behind why it happened from the video. He did indeed get within one arm's distance, and it is common to be pushed away if you violate that distance. My SDI was attacked by a recruit (or rather, an attempted attack), so the DIs will not hesitate to put some distance between them and you if you come too close. And the grabbing of his jacket is OK as far as I know, since one of the allowed intances of touching is to correct a recruit (though I've heard this only applies to drill and shooting stances, which would make it not allowed). But if you watch the video even closer, you see he ran right into him; it's not like the kid was standing five feet away and got slapped. But then comes the ethics: should he have been pushing the recruit if he wanted to go home: absolutely. EVERY SINGLE recruit wants to go home at some point in training. The DIs have to push those they think can make it to get past thier own mental hurdles. Those that prove they cannot are recycled. This kid probably could have made it, and he certainly deserved the chance to prove it, even if he didn't want to try. If you're determined to fail, you can eventually prove it, and the Corps doesn't want someone like that; but just about everyone will be glad thier DIs had faith in them and pushed them to succeed. It's a tragedy this kid died, but let NCIS and Jag decide if the drowning was due to negligence or not. But no matter what, that SDI and the seried CO are probably finished.

By: PVT. Lepper

PVT. Lepper — Thu, 03 Mar 2005 15:40:27 +0000

I recently graduated from Parris Island on Febuary 25th, I was shocked to find out about a recruit drowing at the pool, I thought it would almost be impossible to drown because they have about 15 lifeguards there and you get pulled out of the pool even if you look like youre having difficulty. About the DI "abusing" the recruit, it was said that the recruit was refusing to train. Hes lucky that he didnt have MP's jumping on him. From my experience the physical contact in that video is common. We are being trained to kill, we dont have to be babied and it didnt really bother any of us. He was going through the same thing every one else went through. Even the strong want to quit at times.

By: motiv8tor

motiv8tor — Thu, 03 Mar 2005 06:34:49 +0000

First I would like to send my deepest condolences to the Tharp family. Second, someone stated earlier that nobody is attcking the marine corps or the drill instructors in general, well from what I've read from most of the posts on this site that does seem to be the case. I don't expect anyone who has no clue as to what goes on at the recruit depots to understand the scope of the training. Don't get me wrong I am not saying what happened on that pool deck was classified as "training". The training itself is hard and does or will serve a purpose in time. Everything that goes on is structured and follows a strict SOP. In fact the guidlines are so strict the it really isn't that hard to violate the SOP becuse they cover what is right and wht is wrong to the tiniest of details. I don't know what happened on that pool deck bet to say something was a miss is an understatement I know. But those marines at that pool are the very best at what they do and take great pride in what they do. They train countless hours to prevent such incidents like the one that occured. DI pledge- we will continue to train you even after some of you have given up on yourselves. I said the training is difficult and recruits do want to quit all the time. If we let all of the just get up and say "okay I quit I can't do this I want to go home" there would not be a marine corps. Rct Tharp did not want to continue on in training this we know, but like I said this is common. Rct Tharp was allegedly seen "shaking with fear" talk about sensationalism and trying to play upon the bleeding hearts of the american people. Let me ask you something what does the average person do when they get out of the water after being in it for any length of time? I could be wrong but even in the most temperate of climates most people shiver. The DI was wrong for giving the rct a forearm to the chest but I don't believe you can call that abuse, an asault yes abuse no. The definition of abuse states a corrupt practice or custom. Those kinds of incidents are not customs nor are they practiced at the depots. Do they happen yes of course they do and those who are caught are delt with, while others manage to stay off the radar screen. The marine corps is an awesome institution and this has given us a black eye but we will prevail as always. I have always thought that the marine corps is geared toward individuals who may have a screw loose or two. To thrive in a place the takes pride in destroying foreign enemies and preaches sacrificing your body for your fellow marines and your country, and who has a nightly prayer called the riflemans creed. No this is not for everybody but I love it, and for those who will never understand it and choose to spout off about what they think is true or perceived I say this to you.. go pound sand. Rct Tharp will receive justice, let the investigation take its course. To Sidharta Saenz I say this PFC Humpich and his comments were out of line and definately lacked taste, however he is a young motivated marine with esprit de corps and I would never want to make his life miserable because he wants to be hardcorps. A true leader would give him guidance on having tact. I take it you have never been on the drill field Sidharta, but you seem to have all figured out about being a DI and all. My challenge to you is put your money where your mouth is and pick up a belt and cover and get on the boys/girls!

By: Michelle-Proud Marine WIFE

Michelle-Proud Marine WIFE — Thu, 03 Mar 2005 01:59:14 +0000

I would just like to send a big OOH RAH!!! to the Marines who posted comments here(esp. Proud Marine), both current and former, who have the guts to let the world know the dirty truth about war and what our men and women are up against. Especially to those Vietnam Era Marines who were not given the proper respect upon their return. I only hope that our country has learned from that mistake, as my husband is on his way to Iraq in the near future.
Also, a big Semper Fi to AmandaJ...someone who I can completely relate to.Would love to swap "Drill Field Horror Stories" with you sometime. Do you find that you miss it? As crazy as that may sound!!
Proves we all have a right to express our opinion, Thank God and Thank the United States Marine Corps.

And Jean...please review...there is a distinct difference between a typo and a gramatical error.

By: Sidharta Saenz

Sidharta Saenz — Wed, 02 Mar 2005 16:12:19 +0000

PFC Humpich or whatever your name is, please dont ever make a comment like that, you know why? because you are just a boot who is still brain washed from boot camp, you have no idea of what you are saying, think about all the times when you wanted to get out of boot camp too, and you know you did, I did, even though I Completed it, nobody knows what the Drill Instructors were doing to this kid, and you know they play a lot of games because its funny, there is a lot of DI that become that for one reason, just to fuck around with poor recruits,I know a couple of those. The DI's implicated not only should be suspended but also kicked out, we dont need that type of Marines, we need Marines that will fight against the enemy not against ourselves. My best wishes go to the recruits family and dont you ever dare to call nobody a shitbag, because you are not better than no one else, and please dont let it be that you get stationed in my unit because I will make your life miserable, because you think you are hardcore, bullshit.

By: ES

ES — Wed, 02 Mar 2005 06:23:32 +0000

Well, there are two sides to every story. Even those who have been in the Marines and/or have been married to Marines have differing opinions. Nobody knows what really happened in that pool, but Jason Tharp and the instructors. We'll probably never know. Even with an investigation, we'll probably never know the real truth. I am very grateful that there are people willing to join the armed forces, complete their training, and fight for us in foreign countries. However, I also understand that not everyone is meant to be one of those people. Whether they know it beforehand, or they figure it out after that fact. That doesn't mean that they are less brave, or unworthy of respect either. We all make mistakes, and Jason Tharp clearly recognized his in joining the Marines. Sure, he was young and not used to the rigorous schedule of the military. But, after five weeks he probably would have adapted to it, if he was going to. The fact that he never waivered, and insisted in every letter home that he was not meant to be there, tells me that he wasn't going to adapt. If that's the case, why would the DI's continue to waste their time on a recruit that doesn't want to be there, and is unwilling to train? Is it a prison or a training facility?! Send him home, and be done with it! Would you want to fight in a war with someone who was forced and bullied to stand beside you? I wouldn't! Military experts have seen the video and have clearly stated, even without knowing what was being said, that the DI's "went beyond the Military Code of Conduct". I do believe the video is relevant to his death. If it's not, it's an awfully strange coincidence. You'll never convince me that he drowned during training and nobody noticed. He wasn't a good swimmer, so they should have been watching. I would think an instructors first responsibility to their recruits is their safety above all. It makes no sense. My heart goes out to his family and may Jason Robert Tharp rest in peace.

By: AmandaJ

AmandaJ — Wed, 02 Mar 2005 03:22:36 +0000

Well, I bet your are happy to be out then huh, John?

By: john

john — Wed, 02 Mar 2005 03:03:13 +0000

I recentley went through six weeks of bootcamp. Before I got out. Stuff goes on in there that you don't ever want to know about.

By: Jean

Jean — Tue, 01 Mar 2005 18:15:19 +0000

Bravo to both Spangle and the retired Marine Corps judge advocate for their intelligent postings.I, too, am a proud supporter of our military, but my prayers go out to the Tharp family on the needless death of their son. As for "Michelle-Proud Marine Wife", before you criticize anyone else on their spelling and grammar, go back and read your own postings. I suggest a remedial English course might be in order.

By: Parris Boyd

Parris Boyd — Mon, 28 Feb 2005 23:04:47 +0000

At last. Videotaped evidence of how the military is misrepresented to young people. Mild-mannered recruiters, slick ads, and promises of money for college. Then browbeat 'em into submission when they find out the rest of the story. As a four year Army veteran, I can only hope that Jason Tharp's family finds the strength to file a lawsuite.

By: Jan

Jan — Mon, 28 Feb 2005 22:49:17 +0000

I am a retired Marine Corps judge advocate (lawyer) who spent six years at the Recruit Depot in San Diego, and thus have abundant experience with recruit and DI cases. First of all, the DIs or instructors that hit Pvt Tharp were clearly wrong and should be approrpriately punished. It is amazing that they did that with TV cameras running and news personnel present--it makes one wonder what they might have done when nobody else is around. The unforunate death of Pvt Tharp really raises a lot of questions--apparently it was known that he was a poor swimmer and he should have been watched very closely. As a rifle platoon commander I had to conduct swimming classes-I had a couple of very poor swimmers and they were watched very, very closely. Something really went amiss here.
One more point, it doesn't take long to drown, less than most people might think. However, in a closed environment like the training pool, someone in dire straits should be readily noticed. I have never heard of a drowning death under these circumstances. Hopefully, an adequate autopsy was conducted. Periodically we lose a recruit or young Marine/sailor due to heart defects in circumstances that are otherwise mysterious.

By: Suzie

Suzie — Mon, 28 Feb 2005 21:47:00 +0000

I have a cousin who is a Marine and is currently serving in Iraq. He is from the same High School as Jason Tharp. My cousin called home and was talking to his father about the training in which Jason died. He stated that during all of his basic training, the swim training was what made him the most uneasy. A bunch of recruits were put into the pool and told to get to the other end as fast as you can. The first half through would not have to repeat the exercise. Now, if this is so, shouldn't this be turned into a timed exercise? Therefore taking away the crowding of all of the recruits and removing some of the confusion. If this exercise is so closely watched, I do not understand how a young man could have even come close to drowning accidentally or, as some have absurdly said, committing suicide. I understand that in battle, you are faced with chaos and distraction, but learning to deal with those circumstances comes with time. I did not know Jason personally, but knew who he was. I do agree that not everyone who goes into the program can make it through. My thoughts and prayers go out to the family and I wish them a swift closure to this tragedy. I have children and can in no way imagine how anyone who looses a child deals with that. May God guide and comfort all.

By: aeoirmake

aeoirmake — Mon, 28 Feb 2005 19:46:00 +0000

Hello, I just want to say, I know all those Drill Instructors in the video. I read everyone's comment and everyone has good points and stretched the truth. Yes, we work alot of hours, away from our families alot, don't get alot of sleep because of nightly paperwork. We CHOSE to do this duty and I enjoy it. Our job is to prepare these civilians to become "basically trained Marines" and we will "train them to the best of my ability". I don't think what happened on that video had anything to do with his death, but yes it was a tragedy that this kid died. I am truly, truly sorry for the family. We are doing our best to train these kids to not only survive in war, but have confidence and work as a team when they get to the Fleet Marine Force.