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	<title>Comments on: Obama and McCain Not &#8216;From&#8217; Anywhere</title>
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		<title>By: anjin-san</title>
		<link>http://www.outsidethebeltway.com/archives/obama_and_mccain_not_from_anywhere/comment-page-1/#comment-501817</link>
		<dc:creator>anjin-san</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 18 Aug 2008 02:03:29 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.outsidethebeltway.com/?p=24867#comment-501817</guid>
		<description>&lt;blockquote&gt;The problem is the lack of evidence for any other core values that any of us recognize as being commonly shared with most Americans&lt;/blockquote&gt;

This is patent nonsense. Obama has displayed any number of core American values in his own life. Education, hard work, devotion to family. Community service, recognizing opportunities and taking advantage of them. Public service in the political arena. Advancing himself and his family economically (a self-made millionaire, he did not marry his money).

It is ungracious of you not to acknowledge the fact that Obama has obviously lived core American values and practiced them in his own life across a wide spectrum. If you are going to lecture others on manners, perhaps you should polish your own a bit.

As for &quot;self-promotion&quot;, have you called McCain to task for his almost constant references to his experiences as a POW? My uncle fought at Chosin Reservoir, and I have heard him refer to it exactly once in 50 year. All politic ans are self-promoters, as are most people with successful careers.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<blockquote><p>The problem is the lack of evidence for any other core values that any of us recognize as being commonly shared with most Americans</p></blockquote>
<p>This is patent nonsense. Obama has displayed any number of core American values in his own life. Education, hard work, devotion to family. Community service, recognizing opportunities and taking advantage of them. Public service in the political arena. Advancing himself and his family economically (a self-made millionaire, he did not marry his money).</p>
<p>It is ungracious of you not to acknowledge the fact that Obama has obviously lived core American values and practiced them in his own life across a wide spectrum. If you are going to lecture others on manners, perhaps you should polish your own a bit.</p>
<p>As for "self-promotion", have you called McCain to task for his almost constant references to his experiences as a POW? My uncle fought at Chosin Reservoir, and I have heard him refer to it exactly once in 50 year. All politic ans are self-promoters, as are most people with successful careers.</p>
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		<title>By: anjin-san</title>
		<link>http://www.outsidethebeltway.com/archives/obama_and_mccain_not_from_anywhere/comment-page-1/#comment-501678</link>
		<dc:creator>anjin-san</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sun, 17 Aug 2008 23:06:22 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.outsidethebeltway.com/?p=24867#comment-501678</guid>
		<description>&lt;blockquote&gt;McCain got a rock-solid and abiding &quot;faith&quot; from his grandfather and father — faith in them, in himself, in the U.S. Navy and the other U.S. military forces, &lt;/blockquote&gt;

Unfortunately, McCain&#039;s faith in the US military appears to have led him to the conclusion that military force should be an early, not a last option.

Also interesting to note that faith in God is not mentioned, while faith in himself is...</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<blockquote><p>McCain got a rock-solid and abiding "faith" from his grandfather and father — faith in them, in himself, in the U.S. Navy and the other U.S. military forces, </p></blockquote>
<p>Unfortunately, McCain's faith in the US military appears to have led him to the conclusion that military force should be an early, not a last option.</p>
<p>Also interesting to note that faith in God is not mentioned, while faith in himself is...</p>
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		<title>By: anjin-san</title>
		<link>http://www.outsidethebeltway.com/archives/obama_and_mccain_not_from_anywhere/comment-page-1/#comment-501670</link>
		<dc:creator>anjin-san</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sun, 17 Aug 2008 23:02:30 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.outsidethebeltway.com/?p=24867#comment-501670</guid>
		<description>&lt;blockquote&gt;You&#039;re a rude and nasty person,&lt;/blockquote&gt;

You seem perfectly happy to attack Obama for not having the good fortune to have an Admiral for a father. Perhaps you occupy something of a glass house.

&lt;blockquote&gt;Obama is an impressive self-promoter&lt;/blockquote&gt;

Yes. God forbid a black man should have ambition.  Exactly how  many president have not been self-promoters?</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<blockquote><p>You're a rude and nasty person,</p></blockquote>
<p>You seem perfectly happy to attack Obama for not having the good fortune to have an Admiral for a father. Perhaps you occupy something of a glass house.</p>
<blockquote><p>Obama is an impressive self-promoter</p></blockquote>
<p>Yes. God forbid a black man should have ambition.  Exactly how  many president have not been self-promoters?</p>
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		<title>By: Beldar</title>
		<link>http://www.outsidethebeltway.com/archives/obama_and_mccain_not_from_anywhere/comment-page-1/#comment-501581</link>
		<dc:creator>Beldar</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sun, 17 Aug 2008 22:10:52 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.outsidethebeltway.com/?p=24867#comment-501581</guid>
		<description>anjin-san, you know nothing about me or my accomplishments, and they&#039;re certainly not the point of my post. If they were relevant, I&#039;d gladly put what I&#039;ve done with my law degree up against what Obama has done with his, but you neither actually know or care about that. You&#039;re a rude and nasty person, quick to make personal attacks that you think are clever. I will work harder on ignoring you outright in the future.

As for Obama pulling himself up by his bootstraps, my essay (which you obviously didn&#039;t read) concedes repeatedly that Obama is an impressive self-promoter, and that no one can doubt that the advancement of Barack Obama is among his core values. The problem is the lack of evidence for any &lt;i&gt;other&lt;/i&gt; core values that any of us recognize as being commonly shared with most Americans.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>anjin-san, you know nothing about me or my accomplishments, and they're certainly not the point of my post. If they were relevant, I'd gladly put what I've done with my law degree up against what Obama has done with his, but you neither actually know or care about that. You're a rude and nasty person, quick to make personal attacks that you think are clever. I will work harder on ignoring you outright in the future.</p>
<p>As for Obama pulling himself up by his bootstraps, my essay (which you obviously didn't read) concedes repeatedly that Obama is an impressive self-promoter, and that no one can doubt that the advancement of Barack Obama is among his core values. The problem is the lack of evidence for any <i>other</i> core values that any of us recognize as being commonly shared with most Americans.</p>
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		<title>By: anjin-san</title>
		<link>http://www.outsidethebeltway.com/archives/obama_and_mccain_not_from_anywhere/comment-page-1/#comment-501309</link>
		<dc:creator>anjin-san</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sun, 17 Aug 2008 19:14:50 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.outsidethebeltway.com/?p=24867#comment-501309</guid>
		<description>&lt;blockquote&gt;Barack Obama&#039;s young life, and the people around him then, were filled with unconnected randomness.&lt;/blockquote&gt;

Perhaps. Yet it seems a safe bet that Obama accomplishes more between his first 2 cups of coffee than Beldar does in 6 months...

And if one accepts this premise, it makes Obama&#039;s accomplishments as an adult even more impressive. McCain was born with access to the highest levels of our society. Obama pulled himself up by his bootstraps.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<blockquote><p>Barack Obama's young life, and the people around him then, were filled with unconnected randomness.</p></blockquote>
<p>Perhaps. Yet it seems a safe bet that Obama accomplishes more between his first 2 cups of coffee than Beldar does in 6 months...</p>
<p>And if one accepts this premise, it makes Obama's accomplishments as an adult even more impressive. McCain was born with access to the highest levels of our society. Obama pulled himself up by his bootstraps.</p>
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		<title>By: Beldar</title>
		<link>http://www.outsidethebeltway.com/archives/obama_and_mccain_not_from_anywhere/comment-page-1/#comment-501121</link>
		<dc:creator>Beldar</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sun, 17 Aug 2008 10:42:34 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.outsidethebeltway.com/?p=24867#comment-501121</guid>
		<description>Oh &#151; and the Obama campaign emphatically does not think this is all silly. There&#039;s a good reason why his first general election TV commercial was &lt;a href=&quot;http://www.beldar.org/beldarblog/2008/08/not-from-kansas.html&quot; rel=&quot;nofollow&quot;&gt;carefully crafted&lt;/a&gt; to imply, falsely, that he was raised in Kansas. 

In fact, in his autobiography, Kansas is mentioned as the place his maternal grandparents twice &lt;i&gt;fled&lt;/i&gt;, along with &quot;a series of small towns in Texas,&quot; Los Angeles, and Seattle, before they finally landed in Hawaii. If there are actually any Kansas-specific values that his grandparents or mother taught him, they certainly aren&#039;t mentioned as such in his book. He never lived in Kansas. And the major metropolitan areas in which he&#039;s actually lived as an adult are Los Angeles, New York, Chicago, Boston, and Washington, D.C. &#151; none of them quite as &quot;heartland&quot;-associated as the good brown dust of Kansas that he never actually breathed while growing up.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Oh &#8212; and the Obama campaign emphatically does not think this is all silly. There's a good reason why his first general election TV commercial was <a href="http://www.beldar.org/beldarblog/2008/08/not-from-kansas.html" rel="nofollow">carefully crafted</a> to imply, falsely, that he was raised in Kansas. </p>
<p>In fact, in his autobiography, Kansas is mentioned as the place his maternal grandparents twice <i>fled</i>, along with "a series of small towns in Texas," Los Angeles, and Seattle, before they finally landed in Hawaii. If there are actually any Kansas-specific values that his grandparents or mother taught him, they certainly aren't mentioned as such in his book. He never lived in Kansas. And the major metropolitan areas in which he's actually lived as an adult are Los Angeles, New York, Chicago, Boston, and Washington, D.C. &#8212; none of them quite as "heartland"-associated as the good brown dust of Kansas that he never actually breathed while growing up.</p>
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		<title>By: Beldar</title>
		<link>http://www.outsidethebeltway.com/archives/obama_and_mccain_not_from_anywhere/comment-page-1/#comment-501107</link>
		<dc:creator>Beldar</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sun, 17 Aug 2008 10:30:01 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.outsidethebeltway.com/?p=24867#comment-501107</guid>
		<description>The aptness of the McCain quote from 1982 also struck me when I first read Noonan&#039;s column on Saturday. 

Saturday evening, I finished an overlong essay of my own entitled &lt;a href=&quot;http://www.beldar.org/beldarblog/2008/08/mccain-versus-o.html&quot; rel=&quot;nofollow&quot;&gt;McCain versus Obama: &quot;placelessness,&quot; faith, and dreams&lt;/a&gt;, in which I argue that Noonan was right about Obama, and mostly wrong about McCain. The bold-faced points from my argument are:

Barack Obama&#039;s young life, and the people around him then, were filled with unconnected randomness. John McCain&#039;s young life, and the people around him then, were filled with deeply shared purpose.

Even if one concludes that they share a certain superficial degree of geographic &quot;placelessness,&quot; the candidates&#039; respective book titles thus point out a trite but fundamentally true comparison: McCain got a rock-solid and abiding &quot;faith&quot; from his grandfather and father — faith in them, in himself, in the U.S. Navy and the other U.S. military forces, and most importantly, in all of America — while at best, Obama got only &quot;dreams&quot; from his.

McCain is rooted to the entire United States — and in exactly the same way that he and his father and grandfather weren&#039;t fighting as U.S. Navy officers for Ohio or Texas or Nebraska, but for all of America.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>The aptness of the McCain quote from 1982 also struck me when I first read Noonan's column on Saturday. </p>
<p>Saturday evening, I finished an overlong essay of my own entitled <a href="http://www.beldar.org/beldarblog/2008/08/mccain-versus-o.html" rel="nofollow">McCain versus Obama: "placelessness," faith, and dreams</a>, in which I argue that Noonan was right about Obama, and mostly wrong about McCain. The bold-faced points from my argument are:</p>
<p>Barack Obama's young life, and the people around him then, were filled with unconnected randomness. John McCain's young life, and the people around him then, were filled with deeply shared purpose.</p>
<p>Even if one concludes that they share a certain superficial degree of geographic "placelessness," the candidates' respective book titles thus point out a trite but fundamentally true comparison: McCain got a rock-solid and abiding "faith" from his grandfather and father — faith in them, in himself, in the U.S. Navy and the other U.S. military forces, and most importantly, in all of America — while at best, Obama got only "dreams" from his.</p>
<p>McCain is rooted to the entire United States — and in exactly the same way that he and his father and grandfather weren't fighting as U.S. Navy officers for Ohio or Texas or Nebraska, but for all of America.</p>
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		<title>By: PD Shaw</title>
		<link>http://www.outsidethebeltway.com/archives/obama_and_mccain_not_from_anywhere/comment-page-1/#comment-500272</link>
		<dc:creator>PD Shaw</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sat, 16 Aug 2008 14:19:13 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.outsidethebeltway.com/?p=24867#comment-500272</guid>
		<description>I think Noonan has a point.  Add Romney from Utah, Michigan, Massachusetts and Hillary Clinton from Arkansas, Illinois and New York, you have a new brand of candidates.  The more traditional approach was to identify a candidate from a state and then balance the ticket from another region.  There have been very few succesful Presidencies in which the President and VP were from the same region.  Clinton/Gore may be it.  Obama with an Indiana running mate doesn&#039;t seem odd because Obama is not seen as a regional candidate.  In fact the Midwest may be particularly difficult for him.  

BTW/ Lincoln spent his entire adult life in Illinois (ending up in frontier villages and towns occupied by newcomers).</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I think Noonan has a point.  Add Romney from Utah, Michigan, Massachusetts and Hillary Clinton from Arkansas, Illinois and New York, you have a new brand of candidates.  The more traditional approach was to identify a candidate from a state and then balance the ticket from another region.  There have been very few succesful Presidencies in which the President and VP were from the same region.  Clinton/Gore may be it.  Obama with an Indiana running mate doesn't seem odd because Obama is not seen as a regional candidate.  In fact the Midwest may be particularly difficult for him.  </p>
<p>BTW/ Lincoln spent his entire adult life in Illinois (ending up in frontier villages and towns occupied by newcomers).</p>
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		<title>By: John Burgess</title>
		<link>http://www.outsidethebeltway.com/archives/obama_and_mccain_not_from_anywhere/comment-page-1/#comment-500265</link>
		<dc:creator>John Burgess</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sat, 16 Aug 2008 14:03:19 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.outsidethebeltway.com/?p=24867#comment-500265</guid>
		<description>Derrick: A little reading comprehension problem?

That quote is from 1982, when he was first running for the Senate.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Derrick: A little reading comprehension problem?</p>
<p>That quote is from 1982, when he was first running for the Senate.</p>
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		<title>By: Derrick</title>
		<link>http://www.outsidethebeltway.com/archives/obama_and_mccain_not_from_anywhere/comment-page-1/#comment-500253</link>
		<dc:creator>Derrick</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sat, 16 Aug 2008 13:52:37 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.outsidethebeltway.com/?p=24867#comment-500253</guid>
		<description>I&#039;m glad that again we show how reluctant (sigh!) McCain is to talk about his POW experience.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I'm glad that again we show how reluctant (sigh!) McCain is to talk about his POW experience.</p>
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		<title>By: Dave Schuler</title>
		<link>http://www.outsidethebeltway.com/archives/obama_and_mccain_not_from_anywhere/comment-page-1/#comment-500209</link>
		<dc:creator>Dave Schuler</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sat, 16 Aug 2008 12:50:48 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.outsidethebeltway.com/?p=24867#comment-500209</guid>
		<description>A lot of Americans if not most lack a sense of placeness these days.  I grew up in St. Louis; I&#039;ve spent much of my adult life in Chicago seasoned with a sojourn in Germany and so many business stays in Boston I might as well have been living there.

Woodrow Wilson lived in Virginia, South Carolina, North Carolina, and New Jersey before being elected president.

Did Franklin Roosevelt have a sense of &#147;placeness&#148;.  He was born in New York but he spent much of his early life in school in Massachusetts.

Is it possible that what Ms. Noonan misses are regional accents?  Regional accents have been disappearing in this country ever since the radio industry standardized on a Midwestern dialect for announcers and the practice was later adopted by television.  It was abetted by improved transportation until now the regional dialects evinced by Jimmy Carter, George H. W. Bush (boarding school dialect), Bill Clinton, and George W. Bush are pale reminders of what they once were.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>A lot of Americans if not most lack a sense of placeness these days.  I grew up in St. Louis; I've spent much of my adult life in Chicago seasoned with a sojourn in Germany and so many business stays in Boston I might as well have been living there.</p>
<p>Woodrow Wilson lived in Virginia, South Carolina, North Carolina, and New Jersey before being elected president.</p>
<p>Did Franklin Roosevelt have a sense of &#8220;placeness&#8221;.  He was born in New York but he spent much of his early life in school in Massachusetts.</p>
<p>Is it possible that what Ms. Noonan misses are regional accents?  Regional accents have been disappearing in this country ever since the radio industry standardized on a Midwestern dialect for announcers and the practice was later adopted by television.  It was abetted by improved transportation until now the regional dialects evinced by Jimmy Carter, George H. W. Bush (boarding school dialect), Bill Clinton, and George W. Bush are pale reminders of what they once were.</p>
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