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	<title>Comments on: Obama in Russia:  Good Start or False Start?</title>
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	<description>Online Journal of Politics and Foreign Affairs</description>
	<lastBuildDate>Thu, 26 Nov 2009 05:32:28 -0600</lastBuildDate>
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		<title>By: Weekly Web Watch 07/06/09 – 07/12/09 &#171; EXECUTIVE WATCH</title>
		<link>http://www.outsidethebeltway.com/archives/obama_in_russia_good_start_or_false_start/comment-page-1/#comment-1098352</link>
		<dc:creator>Weekly Web Watch 07/06/09 – 07/12/09 &#171; EXECUTIVE WATCH</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 13 Jul 2009 01:37:55 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.outsidethebeltway.com/?p=39060#comment-1098352</guid>
		<description>[...] President Obama and Russian President Dmitry Medvedev signed a deal to reduce nuclear armaments in the two countries by a third.  Former Defense Secretary James Schlesinger hopes that this is not the first step towards a nuclear-free world.  Dave Schuler has more from both sides. [...]</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>[...] President Obama and Russian President Dmitry Medvedev signed a deal to reduce nuclear armaments in the two countries by a third.  Former Defense Secretary James Schlesinger hopes that this is not the first step towards a nuclear-free world.  Dave Schuler has more from both sides. [...]</p>
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		<title>By: Eric Florack</title>
		<link>http://www.outsidethebeltway.com/archives/obama_in_russia_good_start_or_false_start/comment-page-1/#comment-1091964</link>
		<dc:creator>Eric Florack</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 08 Jul 2009 14:19:40 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.outsidethebeltway.com/?p=39060#comment-1091964</guid>
		<description>Your point is well taken, Steve, yet it&#039;s clear that the Missle Commission&#039;s report was at least misrepresented in your comments.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Your point is well taken, Steve, yet it's clear that the Missle Commission's report was at least misrepresented in your comments.</p>
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		<title>By: Steve Hynd</title>
		<link>http://www.outsidethebeltway.com/archives/obama_in_russia_good_start_or_false_start/comment-page-1/#comment-1091027</link>
		<dc:creator>Steve Hynd</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 07 Jul 2009 23:58:07 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.outsidethebeltway.com/?p=39060#comment-1091027</guid>
		<description>The TD-2 isn&#039;t an ICBM yet either, as it hasn&#039;t been successfully tested. As to Iran. the scaling up to ICBM isn&#039;t at all straightforward. Expert &lt;a href=&quot;http://www.armscontrolwonk.com/2110/designing-irans-icbm-from-the-ground-up&quot; rel=&quot;nofollow&quot;&gt;Geoffrey Forden estimated last year&lt;/a&gt;:
&lt;blockquote&gt;I think even eight years sounds optimistic considering Iran’s known state of development but even that would be considerably longer than Obering’s 2015. And a more realistic estimate might be sometime beyond 2020 and that assumes that Iran has made the strategic decision to develop an ICBM capability; something that is not a logical consequence of the Safir space launch vehicle development.&lt;/blockquote&gt; There&#039;s more good discussion of the technical and cost difficulties here: http://www.fas.org/nuke/intro/missile/icbm.htm

Regards, Steve</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>The TD-2 isn't an ICBM yet either, as it hasn't been successfully tested. As to Iran. the scaling up to ICBM isn't at all straightforward. Expert <a href="http://www.armscontrolwonk.com/2110/designing-irans-icbm-from-the-ground-up" rel="nofollow">Geoffrey Forden estimated last year</a>:</p>
<blockquote><p>I think even eight years sounds optimistic considering Iran&rsquo;s known state of development but even that would be considerably longer than Obering&rsquo;s 2015. And a more realistic estimate might be sometime beyond 2020 and that assumes that Iran has made the strategic decision to develop an ICBM capability; something that is not a logical consequence of the Safir space launch vehicle development.</p></blockquote>
<p> There's more good discussion of the technical and cost difficulties here: <a href="http://www.fas.org/nuke/intro/missile/icbm.htm" rel="nofollow">http://www.fas.org/nuke/intro/missile/icbm.htm</a></p>
<p>Regards, Steve</p>
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		<title>By: The Strategic MC</title>
		<link>http://www.outsidethebeltway.com/archives/obama_in_russia_good_start_or_false_start/comment-page-1/#comment-1090833</link>
		<dc:creator>The Strategic MC</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 07 Jul 2009 21:31:10 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.outsidethebeltway.com/?p=39060#comment-1090833</guid>
		<description>&lt;blockquote&gt;Donald Rumsfield&#039;s notorious Missile Commission which in 1998 said Iran was only five years away from a nuclear missile - the same gap as many analysts believe still exists today.&lt;/blockquote&gt;

Er, not exactly:

&quot;The Commission judges that Iran now has the technical capability and resources to demonstrate an ICBM-range ballistic missile, similar to the
TD-2 (based on scaled-up Scud technology), &lt;strong&gt;within five years of a decision to proceed--whether that decision has already been made or is yet to be
made.&quot;&lt;/strong&gt;

Iran did a Shahab 3 (rng:1000-1300 km)launch in 2004 and successfully launched a satellite earlier this year; an ICBM capability could quickly follow.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<blockquote><p>Donald Rumsfield's notorious Missile Commission which in 1998 said Iran was only five years away from a nuclear missile - the same gap as many analysts believe still exists today.</p></blockquote>
<p>Er, not exactly:</p>
<p>"The Commission judges that Iran now has the technical capability and resources to demonstrate an ICBM-range ballistic missile, similar to the<br />
TD-2 (based on scaled-up Scud technology), <strong>within five years of a decision to proceed--whether that decision has already been made or is yet to be<br />
made."</strong></p>
<p>Iran did a Shahab 3 (rng:1000-1300 km)launch in 2004 and successfully launched a satellite earlier this year; an ICBM capability could quickly follow.</p>
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		<title>By: Dave Schuler</title>
		<link>http://www.outsidethebeltway.com/archives/obama_in_russia_good_start_or_false_start/comment-page-1/#comment-1090796</link>
		<dc:creator>Dave Schuler</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 07 Jul 2009 20:02:31 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.outsidethebeltway.com/?p=39060#comment-1090796</guid>
		<description>Steve:

Right now I&#039;m inclined to favor some level of nuclear arms reduction but I&#039;m not prepared to endorse any number.  I agree with my friend Mark Safranski that President Obama&#039;s stated objective of complete abolition of nuclear weapons by the major powers hasn&#039;t been thought through completely and would probably lead to more war rather than less.

As to &quot;giving credence&quot;, the op-ed was published in the WSJ and the Perry-Schlesinger Commission of which he is a member is a prestigious group.  I neither endorse nor reject his views.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Steve:</p>
<p>Right now I'm inclined to favor some level of nuclear arms reduction but I'm not prepared to endorse any number.  I agree with my friend Mark Safranski that President Obama's stated objective of complete abolition of nuclear weapons by the major powers hasn't been thought through completely and would probably lead to more war rather than less.</p>
<p>As to "giving credence", the op-ed was published in the WSJ and the Perry-Schlesinger Commission of which he is a member is a prestigious group.  I neither endorse nor reject his views.</p>
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		<title>By: UlyssesUnbound</title>
		<link>http://www.outsidethebeltway.com/archives/obama_in_russia_good_start_or_false_start/comment-page-1/#comment-1090785</link>
		<dc:creator>UlyssesUnbound</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 07 Jul 2009 19:56:30 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.outsidethebeltway.com/?p=39060#comment-1090785</guid>
		<description>Charles,

According to NPR this morning, they did indeed have the reset button on public display.  I believe they said it was on display in a park in Moscow, but my memory for minutia has been faulty before.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Charles,</p>
<p>According to NPR this morning, they did indeed have the reset button on public display.  I believe they said it was on display in a park in Moscow, but my memory for minutia has been faulty before.</p>
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		<title>By: charles austin</title>
		<link>http://www.outsidethebeltway.com/archives/obama_in_russia_good_start_or_false_start/comment-page-1/#comment-1090774</link>
		<dc:creator>charles austin</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 07 Jul 2009 19:52:08 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.outsidethebeltway.com/?p=39060#comment-1090774</guid>
		<description>Just curious, did President Medvedev or Prime Minister Putin have Secretary Clinton&#039;s &quot;&lt;a href=&quot;http://www.swamppolitics.com/news/politics/blog/2009/03/clintons_reset_button_overchar_1.html&quot; rel=&quot;nofollow&quot;&gt;reset button&lt;/a&gt;&quot; anywhere on display?</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Just curious, did President Medvedev or Prime Minister Putin have Secretary Clinton's "<a href="http://www.swamppolitics.com/news/politics/blog/2009/03/clintons_reset_button_overchar_1.html" rel="nofollow">reset button</a>" anywhere on display?</p>
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		<title>By: Steve Hynd</title>
		<link>http://www.outsidethebeltway.com/archives/obama_in_russia_good_start_or_false_start/comment-page-1/#comment-1090749</link>
		<dc:creator>Steve Hynd</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 07 Jul 2009 19:43:24 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.outsidethebeltway.com/?p=39060#comment-1090749</guid>
		<description>I&#039;d think that if the strategy is to avoid worldwide nuclear holocaust then arms control numbers are a perfect metric to use to drive that strategy. Payne obviously doesn&#039;t care about sane strategy so much as that the U.S. shouldn&#039;t give something away for nothing. It&#039;s a ridiculous posture to take. So what if the Russians end up with a treaty to do what they were going to have to do anyway? We all end up safer by both sides&#039; reductions and their agreement that such reductions are a good thing.

But Payne, the leader of the neoconservative National Institute for Public Policy which has been a staunch cheerleader for Bush&#039;s missile defense plans and replacement warhead program, is more interested in might makes right than in the safety of humanity. He argued in 1980 that the &quot;United States must possess the ability to wage nuclear war rationally&quot; and that &quot;the West needs to devise ways in which it can employ strategic nuclear forces coercively, while minimizing the potentially paralyzing impact of self-deterrence.&quot; Payne also served on Donald Rumsfield&#039;s notorious Missile Commission which in 1998 said Iran was only five years away from a nuclear missile - the same gap as many analysts believe still exists today. 

Why is anyone giving any credence to someone with these views?

Regards, Steve</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I'd think that if the strategy is to avoid worldwide nuclear holocaust then arms control numbers are a perfect metric to use to drive that strategy. Payne obviously doesn't care about sane strategy so much as that the U.S. shouldn't give something away for nothing. It's a ridiculous posture to take. So what if the Russians end up with a treaty to do what they were going to have to do anyway? We all end up safer by both sides' reductions and their agreement that such reductions are a good thing.</p>
<p>But Payne, the leader of the neoconservative National Institute for Public Policy which has been a staunch cheerleader for Bush's missile defense plans and replacement warhead program, is more interested in might makes right than in the safety of humanity. He argued in 1980 that the "United States must possess the ability to wage nuclear war rationally" and that "the West needs to devise ways in which it can employ strategic nuclear forces coercively, while minimizing the potentially paralyzing impact of self-deterrence." Payne also served on Donald Rumsfield's notorious Missile Commission which in 1998 said Iran was only five years away from a nuclear missile - the same gap as many analysts believe still exists today. </p>
<p>Why is anyone giving any credence to someone with these views?</p>
<p>Regards, Steve</p>
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		<title>By: charles austin</title>
		<link>http://www.outsidethebeltway.com/archives/obama_in_russia_good_start_or_false_start/comment-page-1/#comment-1090609</link>
		<dc:creator>charles austin</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 07 Jul 2009 17:23:56 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.outsidethebeltway.com/?p=39060#comment-1090609</guid>
		<description>I doubt that we can destroy the world even if we wanted to, but that&#039;s a quibble for another time.  But your supposition seems to infer that destroying the world is on the list of potential objectives, which is kind of weird.  I cannot envision any scenario on either side that calls for launching all weapons.  Ever.  But I digress.

Further to Boyd&#039;s comment, the different platforms (ground, air, sea) for deployment mean there has to be some level of redundancy in addition to rotation and &quot;sparing&quot;.  As I recall, the warheards themselves must be refurbished periodically.

Perhaps now is a good time as any to remind our young president of Ronald Reagan&#039;s maxim, &quot;Trust, but verify.&quot;</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I doubt that we can destroy the world even if we wanted to, but that's a quibble for another time.  But your supposition seems to infer that destroying the world is on the list of potential objectives, which is kind of weird.  I cannot envision any scenario on either side that calls for launching all weapons.  Ever.  But I digress.</p>
<p>Further to Boyd's comment, the different platforms (ground, air, sea) for deployment mean there has to be some level of redundancy in addition to rotation and "sparing".  As I recall, the warheards themselves must be refurbished periodically.</p>
<p>Perhaps now is a good time as any to remind our young president of Ronald Reagan's maxim, "Trust, but verify."</p>
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		<title>By: Michael Reynolds</title>
		<link>http://www.outsidethebeltway.com/archives/obama_in_russia_good_start_or_false_start/comment-page-1/#comment-1090607</link>
		<dc:creator>Michael Reynolds</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 07 Jul 2009 17:21:13 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.outsidethebeltway.com/?p=39060#comment-1090607</guid>
		<description>I would hate to find that we needed to obliterate, say, 1300 enemy military targets or cities and there we are stuck with just 1000 warheads.  That would suck.  

I mean, reverse the situation.  We have 273 cities with populations of over 100,000.  How would the Russians feel if they could only destroy our 273 largest cities and 727 military targets?  We&#039;d be sitting here laughing!  

Well, not&lt;em&gt; here.&lt;/em&gt;  But if we lived in Johnson City, TN, we&#039;d be like, &quot;That&#039;s all you got?&quot;</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I would hate to find that we needed to obliterate, say, 1300 enemy military targets or cities and there we are stuck with just 1000 warheads.  That would suck.  </p>
<p>I mean, reverse the situation.  We have 273 cities with populations of over 100,000.  How would the Russians feel if they could only destroy our 273 largest cities and 727 military targets?  We'd be sitting here laughing!  </p>
<p>Well, not<em> here.</em>  But if we lived in Johnson City, TN, we'd be like, "That's all you got?"</p>
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		<title>By: From Russia, Without Nukes &#171; Around The Sphere</title>
		<link>http://www.outsidethebeltway.com/archives/obama_in_russia_good_start_or_false_start/comment-page-1/#comment-1090577</link>
		<dc:creator>From Russia, Without Nukes &#171; Around The Sphere</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 07 Jul 2009 16:21:12 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.outsidethebeltway.com/?p=39060#comment-1090577</guid>
		<description>[...] Dave Schuler [...]</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>[...] Dave Schuler [...]</p>
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		<title>By: Boyd</title>
		<link>http://www.outsidethebeltway.com/archives/obama_in_russia_good_start_or_false_start/comment-page-1/#comment-1090522</link>
		<dc:creator>Boyd</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 07 Jul 2009 14:43:28 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.outsidethebeltway.com/?p=39060#comment-1090522</guid>
		<description>Warheads and delivery vehicles aren&#039;t plug-and-play; there are different models to suit different purposes, and that necessitates some redundancy.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Warheads and delivery vehicles aren't plug-and-play; there are different models to suit different purposes, and that necessitates some redundancy.</p>
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		<title>By: Furhead</title>
		<link>http://www.outsidethebeltway.com/archives/obama_in_russia_good_start_or_false_start/comment-page-1/#comment-1090454</link>
		<dc:creator>Furhead</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 07 Jul 2009 13:46:44 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.outsidethebeltway.com/?p=39060#comment-1090454</guid>
		<description>&lt;blockquote&gt;Strategic requirements should drive force numbers; arms-control numbers should not dictate strategy.&lt;/blockquote&gt;

Arms control and strategy aren&#039;t completely separate things.  It may be, for example, that we want less nuclear material floating around in unstable portions of the world.  Of course, Russia is a bit more stable these days than during the breakup of the USSR.

As it is, we both could pretty much destroy the world several times over, right?  This may be a dumb question, but what strategic requirement is needed to destroy the world more than once?  (Yes, I realize that some presumably small fraction of the arsenal could be destroyed in an attack before we were able to launch it.)</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<blockquote><p>Strategic requirements should drive force numbers; arms-control numbers should not dictate strategy.</p></blockquote>
<p>Arms control and strategy aren't completely separate things.  It may be, for example, that we want less nuclear material floating around in unstable portions of the world.  Of course, Russia is a bit more stable these days than during the breakup of the USSR.</p>
<p>As it is, we both could pretty much destroy the world several times over, right?  This may be a dumb question, but what strategic requirement is needed to destroy the world more than once?  (Yes, I realize that some presumably small fraction of the arsenal could be destroyed in an attack before we were able to launch it.)</p>
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		<title>By: The Glittering Eye &#187; Blog Archive &#187; Foreign Policy Posting at OTB</title>
		<link>http://www.outsidethebeltway.com/archives/obama_in_russia_good_start_or_false_start/comment-page-1/#comment-1090425</link>
		<dc:creator>The Glittering Eye &#187; Blog Archive &#187; Foreign Policy Posting at OTB</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 07 Jul 2009 13:21:15 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.outsidethebeltway.com/?p=39060#comment-1090425</guid>
		<description>[...] morning I&#8217;ve published a post at Outside the Beltway: &#8220;Obama in Russia: Good Start or False [...]</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>[...] morning I&#8217;ve published a post at Outside the Beltway: &#8220;Obama in Russia: Good Start or False [...]</p>
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