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	<title>Comments on: Our Domestic Intelligence Crisis</title>
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		<title>By: Hal</title>
		<link>http://www.outsidethebeltway.com/archives/our_domestic_intelligence_crisis/comment-page-1/#comment-69129</link>
		<dc:creator>Hal</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sat, 24 Dec 2005 03:41:03 +0000</pubDate>
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		<description>Really love the authoritarian tone your commenters have been providing, James.  Kind of cool.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Really love the authoritarian tone your commenters have been providing, James.  Kind of cool.</p>
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		<title>By: Herb</title>
		<link>http://www.outsidethebeltway.com/archives/our_domestic_intelligence_crisis/comment-page-1/#comment-69011</link>
		<dc:creator>Herb</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 22 Dec 2005 20:29:22 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.outsidethebeltway.com/?p=13061#comment-69011</guid>
		<description>John Burgess:

Never thought of the noodle thing, but, come to think of it, he does sound like a noodle head and acts that way to.

Personally, I have always thought he was a left wing plant on OTB. Maybe he&#039;s noodle squash.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>John Burgess:</p>
<p>Never thought of the noodle thing, but, come to think of it, he does sound like a noodle head and acts that way to.</p>
<p>Personally, I have always thought he was a left wing plant on OTB. Maybe he's noodle squash.</p>
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		<title>By: John Burgess</title>
		<link>http://www.outsidethebeltway.com/archives/our_domestic_intelligence_crisis/comment-page-1/#comment-68971</link>
		<dc:creator>John Burgess</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 22 Dec 2005 15:39:42 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.outsidethebeltway.com/?p=13061#comment-68971</guid>
		<description>Herb, I&#039;ve so gathered from his comments. 

What I ask now is, &quot;where&#039;s the damn NSA?&quot; Why aren&#039;t they taking his raggedy ass down? 

But it is cute that he takes his name from a bag of ramen noodles...</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Herb, I've so gathered from his comments. </p>
<p>What I ask now is, "where's the damn NSA?" Why aren't they taking his raggedy ass down? </p>
<p>But it is cute that he takes his name from a bag of ramen noodles...</p>
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		<title>By: Herb</title>
		<link>http://www.outsidethebeltway.com/archives/our_domestic_intelligence_crisis/comment-page-1/#comment-68933</link>
		<dc:creator>Herb</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 22 Dec 2005 12:57:56 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.outsidethebeltway.com/?p=13061#comment-68933</guid>
		<description>John Burgess:

I can tell you that trying to get through to Anjin is a hopeless cause. He put himself up like some sort of a &quot;Freedom Martyer&quot; and has very little good to say about this country. He has indicated his support (Understanding) for terrorists and consistantly and constantly has negative thngs to say about about everything in this country. He sometimes trys to pass himself off as a conservative, but is about a far left wing California liberal as you can get. 

So John, just don&#039;t waste your time with him Like I have said before, Anjin might call himself an American, but he is far from it.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>John Burgess:</p>
<p>I can tell you that trying to get through to Anjin is a hopeless cause. He put himself up like some sort of a "Freedom Martyer" and has very little good to say about this country. He has indicated his support (Understanding) for terrorists and consistantly and constantly has negative thngs to say about about everything in this country. He sometimes trys to pass himself off as a conservative, but is about a far left wing California liberal as you can get. </p>
<p>So John, just don't waste your time with him Like I have said before, Anjin might call himself an American, but he is far from it.</p>
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		<title>By: anjin-san</title>
		<link>http://www.outsidethebeltway.com/archives/our_domestic_intelligence_crisis/comment-page-1/#comment-68899</link>
		<dc:creator>anjin-san</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 22 Dec 2005 03:12:01 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.outsidethebeltway.com/?p=13061#comment-68899</guid>
		<description>Damn, did not realize James Bond was posting here...</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Damn, did not realize James Bond was posting here...</p>
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		<title>By: John Burgess</title>
		<link>http://www.outsidethebeltway.com/archives/our_domestic_intelligence_crisis/comment-page-1/#comment-68898</link>
		<dc:creator>John Burgess</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 22 Dec 2005 03:04:02 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.outsidethebeltway.com/?p=13061#comment-68898</guid>
		<description>Anji-san, you don&#039;t quite get it.

I worked, in the Middle East, for the government. I&#039;ve had over a dozen friends killed by terrorists from Libya, Hizabollah, and Al-Qaeda. I was in Riyadh when the 2003 bombings took place--as well as when over a dozen foreigners were killed individually or in pairs. My wife and son have been caught in crossfires between insurgents and government forces and I&#039;ve had guns put to my head more than once. I also continued to fly using my diplomatic passport when, had my plane been hijacked, I would have been murdered.

Having actually seen and felt the effects of bad guys, coming from bad places, with bad attitudes, I can make a rational decision about what constitutes real danger. I also have perspective to tell the difference between trivial inconveniences to one&#039;s inflated ego (as if the government could care) and real threats. 

I&#039;m happy that warrantless intercepts have kept you safe. I&#039;m even more glad that they&#039;ve kept me safe. I have sometimes wondered, though, whether keeping you safe was what I put my life at risk for. Hardly seems worth it.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Anji-san, you don't quite get it.</p>
<p>I worked, in the Middle East, for the government. I've had over a dozen friends killed by terrorists from Libya, Hizabollah, and Al-Qaeda. I was in Riyadh when the 2003 bombings took place--as well as when over a dozen foreigners were killed individually or in pairs. My wife and son have been caught in crossfires between insurgents and government forces and I've had guns put to my head more than once. I also continued to fly using my diplomatic passport when, had my plane been hijacked, I would have been murdered.</p>
<p>Having actually seen and felt the effects of bad guys, coming from bad places, with bad attitudes, I can make a rational decision about what constitutes real danger. I also have perspective to tell the difference between trivial inconveniences to one's inflated ego (as if the government could care) and real threats. </p>
<p>I'm happy that warrantless intercepts have kept you safe. I'm even more glad that they've kept me safe. I have sometimes wondered, though, whether keeping you safe was what I put my life at risk for. Hardly seems worth it.</p>
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		<title>By: anjin-san</title>
		<link>http://www.outsidethebeltway.com/archives/our_domestic_intelligence_crisis/comment-page-1/#comment-68892</link>
		<dc:creator>anjin-san</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 22 Dec 2005 01:09:35 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.outsidethebeltway.com/?p=13061#comment-68892</guid>
		<description>Is that the prattle of the dead I hear?</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Is that the prattle of the dead I hear?</p>
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		<title>By: Herb</title>
		<link>http://www.outsidethebeltway.com/archives/our_domestic_intelligence_crisis/comment-page-1/#comment-68891</link>
		<dc:creator>Herb</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 22 Dec 2005 00:49:44 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.outsidethebeltway.com/?p=13061#comment-68891</guid>
		<description>Anjin:

You conveniently forgot to mention the &quot;Carterites and the The Clintonites.

You are so full of it, your eyeballs are Brown.

Tell everyone here when your libertys have been infringed upon that affected you directly.

I bet you can&#039;t do it.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Anjin:</p>
<p>You conveniently forgot to mention the "Carterites and the The Clintonites.</p>
<p>You are so full of it, your eyeballs are Brown.</p>
<p>Tell everyone here when your libertys have been infringed upon that affected you directly.</p>
<p>I bet you can't do it.</p>
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		<title>By: Herb</title>
		<link>http://www.outsidethebeltway.com/archives/our_domestic_intelligence_crisis/comment-page-1/#comment-68890</link>
		<dc:creator>Herb</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 22 Dec 2005 00:45:07 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.outsidethebeltway.com/?p=13061#comment-68890</guid>
		<description>I must now assume that the &quot;Defenders of the Constitution&quot; are talking about Carter, Clinton and LBJ, who started the escallation of the Vietnam war with a boldfaced lie&quot; (Gulf of Tonkin Incident) were amoung those who spyed on them taking away their libertys and changing their lives and lifestyles forever. I feel so bad for them. They have been scared forever and they now have to live their lives with the trama of being found out. 

This goes back to the old saying,  &quot;What you don&#039;t know, won&#039;t hurt you&quot;. But, I guess that&#039;s over their heads.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I must now assume that the "Defenders of the Constitution" are talking about Carter, Clinton and LBJ, who started the escallation of the Vietnam war with a boldfaced lie" (Gulf of Tonkin Incident) were amoung those who spyed on them taking away their libertys and changing their lives and lifestyles forever. I feel so bad for them. They have been scared forever and they now have to live their lives with the trama of being found out. </p>
<p>This goes back to the old saying,  "What you don't know, won't hurt you". But, I guess that's over their heads.</p>
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		<title>By: anjin-san</title>
		<link>http://www.outsidethebeltway.com/archives/our_domestic_intelligence_crisis/comment-page-1/#comment-68888</link>
		<dc:creator>anjin-san</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 22 Dec 2005 00:26:19 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.outsidethebeltway.com/?p=13061#comment-68888</guid>
		<description>Yep, the founding fathers would be proud of stalwart Americans like John B. who&#039;s position is &quot;yes, spy on me, read my mail, tap my phone, just please, oh please, don&#039;t let Osama hurt me&quot;.

Yes it was upon the stalwart, unwavering, fearless shoulders of men such as he that this nation was built.

Just kidding, I think the founding fathers said &quot;Give me liberty or give me death&quot;.

Amen</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Yep, the founding fathers would be proud of stalwart Americans like John B. who's position is "yes, spy on me, read my mail, tap my phone, just please, oh please, don't let Osama hurt me".</p>
<p>Yes it was upon the stalwart, unwavering, fearless shoulders of men such as he that this nation was built.</p>
<p>Just kidding, I think the founding fathers said "Give me liberty or give me death".</p>
<p>Amen</p>
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		<title>By: Arcs</title>
		<link>http://www.outsidethebeltway.com/archives/our_domestic_intelligence_crisis/comment-page-1/#comment-68881</link>
		<dc:creator>Arcs</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 21 Dec 2005 22:23:17 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.outsidethebeltway.com/?p=13061#comment-68881</guid>
		<description>I&#039;m finding this all rather laughable.

Has anyone stopped to wonder why the string of presidents writing executive orders to authorize these activities stops at Carter? Simply because before then, there was No Such Agency.

I say, let them do the job they&#039;ve been doing since they began right after WWII. Maybe they&#039;re getting better at it.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I'm finding this all rather laughable.</p>
<p>Has anyone stopped to wonder why the string of presidents writing executive orders to authorize these activities stops at Carter? Simply because before then, there was No Such Agency.</p>
<p>I say, let them do the job they've been doing since they began right after WWII. Maybe they're getting better at it.</p>
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		<title>By: John Burgess</title>
		<link>http://www.outsidethebeltway.com/archives/our_domestic_intelligence_crisis/comment-page-1/#comment-68877</link>
		<dc:creator>John Burgess</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 21 Dec 2005 22:04:18 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.outsidethebeltway.com/?p=13061#comment-68877</guid>
		<description>Having lived and worked in police states, I can tell the difference between them and the US pretty readily. There is simply no comparison and only a fool would think there was any similarity.

I did learn to live with--because there was no alternative--my phone being tapped, people I spoke with being &quot;invited&quot; to discuss the conversation with secret police, and having my home bugged. I also learned how to get around the inconveniences, or to ignore them when they were unavoidable. And yes, I even modified my behavior at times to avoid putting people (including myself and my family) in danger.

Because I call and e-mail people in the Middle East, I suspect that I&#039;m putting my communications at greater risk of being surveilled than a typical American. That&#039;s fine with me. My communications aren&#039;t involved with terrorism, money laundering, kiddy-porn, or the violent overthrow of the United States. The gov&#039;t can read my mail.

I sincerely doubt that it&#039;s interested in what books I&#039;ve just read, what movies I&#039;ve just seen, whom I may or may not be sleeping with. I assume that they&#039;re looking for something with a little more intrinsic value.

If some jerk-off is going to be peeping into a hot little e-mail I&#039;ve sent off to that Kuwaiti cutie, that&#039;s his problem, not mine, other than that he&#039;s wasting my tax dollars by not doing his job. He&#039;s got so much stuff to look at for important information that I don&#039;t delude myself that I&#039;m of great interest.

I think the complaints are coming from those with rather inflated egos who think their little lives somehow rise to the level of &quot;I give a shit&quot;.

If the government, by looking at my mail along with that of millions of others, can find and deter a terrorist attack, I&#039;ll swallow my self-esteem.

The program currently being indicted by the left actually doesn&#039;t give a damn about your meth lab, your pink panties, your half-terabyte of porn, unless those are somehow also involved in terrorism.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Having lived and worked in police states, I can tell the difference between them and the US pretty readily. There is simply no comparison and only a fool would think there was any similarity.</p>
<p>I did learn to live with--because there was no alternative--my phone being tapped, people I spoke with being "invited" to discuss the conversation with secret police, and having my home bugged. I also learned how to get around the inconveniences, or to ignore them when they were unavoidable. And yes, I even modified my behavior at times to avoid putting people (including myself and my family) in danger.</p>
<p>Because I call and e-mail people in the Middle East, I suspect that I'm putting my communications at greater risk of being surveilled than a typical American. That's fine with me. My communications aren't involved with terrorism, money laundering, kiddy-porn, or the violent overthrow of the United States. The gov't can read my mail.</p>
<p>I sincerely doubt that it's interested in what books I've just read, what movies I've just seen, whom I may or may not be sleeping with. I assume that they're looking for something with a little more intrinsic value.</p>
<p>If some jerk-off is going to be peeping into a hot little e-mail I've sent off to that Kuwaiti cutie, that's his problem, not mine, other than that he's wasting my tax dollars by not doing his job. He's got so much stuff to look at for important information that I don't delude myself that I'm of great interest.</p>
<p>I think the complaints are coming from those with rather inflated egos who think their little lives somehow rise to the level of "I give a shit".</p>
<p>If the government, by looking at my mail along with that of millions of others, can find and deter a terrorist attack, I'll swallow my self-esteem.</p>
<p>The program currently being indicted by the left actually doesn't give a damn about your meth lab, your pink panties, your half-terabyte of porn, unless those are somehow also involved in terrorism.</p>
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		<title>By: Anderson</title>
		<link>http://www.outsidethebeltway.com/archives/our_domestic_intelligence_crisis/comment-page-1/#comment-68866</link>
		<dc:creator>Anderson</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 21 Dec 2005 21:18:59 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.outsidethebeltway.com/?p=13061#comment-68866</guid>
		<description>JJ, the whole point is that, step by step, each time for an allegedly good reason (that usually turns out to be bogus), we get our liberties whittled away.

OT, the 4th Circuit has &lt;i&gt;burned&lt;/i&gt; the feds on their petition to get Padilla transferred to DOJ custody.  I would not have believed that Luttig could be this harsh.  Opinion &lt;a href=&quot;http://pacer.ca4.uscourts.gov/opinion.pdf/056396R1.P.pdf&quot; rel=&quot;nofollow&quot;&gt;here&lt;/a&gt;; my good-parts collection &lt;a href=&quot;http://andersonblog.blogspot.com/2005/12/4th-circuit-to-feds-how-dumb-do-you.html&quot; rel=&quot;nofollow&quot;&gt;here&lt;/a&gt;.  The op is worthy of an OTB post, IMHO.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>JJ, the whole point is that, step by step, each time for an allegedly good reason (that usually turns out to be bogus), we get our liberties whittled away.</p>
<p>OT, the 4th Circuit has <i>burned</i> the feds on their petition to get Padilla transferred to DOJ custody.  I would not have believed that Luttig could be this harsh.  Opinion <a href="http://pacer.ca4.uscourts.gov/opinion.pdf/056396R1.P.pdf" rel="nofollow">here</a>; my good-parts collection <a href="http://andersonblog.blogspot.com/2005/12/4th-circuit-to-feds-how-dumb-do-you.html" rel="nofollow">here</a>.  The op is worthy of an OTB post, IMHO.</p>
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		<title>By: legion</title>
		<link>http://www.outsidethebeltway.com/archives/our_domestic_intelligence_crisis/comment-page-1/#comment-68865</link>
		<dc:creator>legion</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 21 Dec 2005 21:05:23 +0000</pubDate>
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		<description>I&#039;m thinking RA is exactly the sort of person Benjamin Franklin had in mind for his famous quote about sacrificing libery for security...

And Jonk, there are enormous differences in what a _private_ entity, like a credit agency, can do vs. what a _public_ entity, like our elected federal gov&#039;t can.

And finally, I want to draw attention to one of Posner&#039;s more outrageous whitewashes... &lt;blockquote&gt;The Pentagon&#039;s rush to fill gaps in domestic intelligence reflects the disarray in this vital yet neglected area of national security.&lt;/blockquote&gt; 
&quot;Rush to fill gaps&quot;?!?  That&#039;s a hell of a euphemism for &quot;decide on their own which laws to break and which to follow&quot;. I&#039;m pretty sure neither the SecDef, nor even the President, can viably use &#039;civil disobedieance&#039; as a defense...</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I'm thinking RA is exactly the sort of person Benjamin Franklin had in mind for his famous quote about sacrificing libery for security...</p>
<p>And Jonk, there are enormous differences in what a _private_ entity, like a credit agency, can do vs. what a _public_ entity, like our elected federal gov't can.</p>
<p>And finally, I want to draw attention to one of Posner's more outrageous whitewashes...<br />
<blockquote>The Pentagon's rush to fill gaps in domestic intelligence reflects the disarray in this vital yet neglected area of national security.</p></blockquote>
<p>"Rush to fill gaps"?!?  That's a hell of a euphemism for "decide on their own which laws to break and which to follow". I'm pretty sure neither the SecDef, nor even the President, can viably use 'civil disobedieance' as a defense...</p>
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		<title>By: James Joyner</title>
		<link>http://www.outsidethebeltway.com/archives/our_domestic_intelligence_crisis/comment-page-1/#comment-68863</link>
		<dc:creator>James Joyner</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 21 Dec 2005 20:55:10 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.outsidethebeltway.com/?p=13061#comment-68863</guid>
		<description>Anderson: Don&#039;t disagree in theory but the right to talk to foreign terrorists on the telephone in peace is pretty low on the list of civil liberties, no?</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Anderson: Don't disagree in theory but the right to talk to foreign terrorists on the telephone in peace is pretty low on the list of civil liberties, no?</p>
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