So, there's no better way to deal with the problem, than government?

Lets hear your solution. I am all ears.

Pathetic.

How so? We still have a long way to go, but we have made great strides in dealing with our pollution problems, thanks to government regulation. Or would you be happier if we had China's pollution problems?

And you are still ducking my question...

Are you a Malliard or a Merganzer?

Really Bit, do you look at the world with the level of simplicity that your posts suggest?

So, it wasn't a simple POV that caused you to try and set me up as an extremist? But guess who ended up with that label? Don't be blaming ME if that's the effect of YOUR words, Anjin. Enjoy the bed you've made.

Its pretty simple. One of the main reasons we have made progress on the environment is government regulation.

So, there's no better way to deal with the problem, than government?

Pathetic.

Is there such a thing as unproductive, misguided or downright stupid reactions to your concerns? Of course there is. Gosh, just listen to me. Clearly I am a "fanatic".

Really Bit, do you look at the world with the level of simplicity that your posts suggest? You keep injecting nonsense like "hero worship" and "religion" into the discussion. Can Paris Hilton be far behind?

So you have bobbed and weaved and, as usual. ducked the question. Not a bad strategy when you can't support your own position.

Its pretty simple. One of the main reasons we have made progress on the environment is government regulation. I can see why you prefer to sidestep that discussion.

Anjin-san, We do not have the power to render Earth uninhabitable. To believe that is the height of arrogance and ignorance.

Completely uninhabitable? Probably not. But then I did not say that, did I?

What do you think this planet would look like after a full out, nothing held back nuclear war? Yes there would be life, and yes, over the course of time the planet would probably heal. But large percentage of what is alive now would probably die in the war and its aftermath, and we do have the power to do that...

To believe that is the height of arrogance and ignorance.

Ok. Can you support that statement?

Mother Earth adapts to every disaster that occurs, including the ones we produce

There is something to that. Have you ever considered that part of her healing process might be getting rid of the critters that are causing the problems?

Ours are minor compared to the ones produced by Mother Earth herself.

hmmm. Ok, can you explain things such as dead zones in the ocean and 25% of California's bird species being stressed to the point where danger of extinction is not an exaggerated concern?

Man is the first creature to come along with the intelligence to severely impact the environment in a negative way. Kind of a wild card. Just saying "Mother Earth will heal the wounds" is kind of a lame strategy for the long-term survival of our and other species...

Is there a thing such as too much concern? Of course not.

Folks, that explosion you just heard was the attempt to paint me an extremist dying the sudden and violent death it deserves.

And that attempt, let's be honest about it, is the only reason Anjin even asked the question of me he did. The answer to which is surrounded in logic so simple that even Anjin should be able to answer it;

The use of the word "Balance" on my part suggests that environmental concern per se', is not totally without merit. The problem of course is tehse days, it's nothing shy of a religion... as Anjin handily demonstrated for us.

Game over.

By the way, Pete; You're quite correct.

It's possible I don't understand your comment. I don't recall my having posted that China “is racing to meet the US”. Or it's possible you're misinformed. 70% of the US economy is based on consumer spending. That leaves 30% for everything else. Only about 6% of our economy is exports.

The picture is quite different in China. Roughly 15% of their GDP and 60% of the growth in their economy is exports.

balance and fanatisism.

Is there a thing such as too much concern? Of course not. Our environment is were all life on our planet is, and we have the power now to render this planet largely uninhabitable.

If we were to do that, I think the survivors might view Hitler and Stalin as pikers in the mass murder department.

It's sort of like asking if there is such a thing as too much concern for one's health. You can just be cruising along through life, then suddenly its "sorry you have terminal cancer, six months to live. Rough break". And then years of not taking care of yourself don't seem like such a great idea.

The line between balance and fanaticism? Lets address that after you have responded to my question...

Not unexpected.

Heh... here's the thing; So was I. One of the best examples one could think of. Total moonbat.

Well, name calling can keep one occupied at recess, but I notice you completely ducked the issue of out of control pollution in this country in the mid 20th century and how that trend was reversed.

What saved us from swimming in our own crap? How come streams that were nearly dead 40 years ago are healthy spawning grounds now? Magic ponies?

As for Gore, I use him only as an example of an environmental activism.

Heh... here's the thing; So was I. One of the best examples one could think of. Total moonbat.

Balance??? Thanks, coming from you, that will provide days worth of laughs.

Well, we may as well spread the laughs around. Tell us, Anjin, is there such a thing as too much concern for the environment? Where does that threshold exist, assuming it does?

Japan didn't end up overtaking us

Japan's economy has always been resource poor, a fundamental weakness. It was one of the root causes of WW2. For all their talent, energy and ambition, Japan is only going to go so far.

China does not really suffer that problem.

Utter nonsense.
So, before Al Gore showed up, we were all swimming in our own sludge? Don't you think this hero worship things done got a bit outta hand?

Do you remember what the air was like in the LA Basin in the 60s? When you could grow up in LA and never see the San Gaberial mountains? Do you remember when the Cuyahoga River caught on fire? Love Canal? When people did oil changes in the driveway and dumped the used oil down the sewer?

These things got better because environmental activists and concerned citizens forced the enacting of legislation to clean up the environment, not because concerned corporations decided to squeeze their margins a bit for the common good.

Spend a little time in Mexico inhaling the fumes from each car that goes by. Imagine if every car in America was still like that.

As for Gore, I use him only as an example of an environmental activism. The environmental movement that saved us from China like pollution started in the 50s. (Actually several early victories were won in Marin County, my home turf),

Hero worship? Is that the best you can do? I did not even vote for him in 2000. But I will give him credit where credit is due. Try harder dude.

Balance??? Thanks, coming from you, that will provide days worth of laughs.

Since when do you care about pollution?

There's a word you should consider adding to your vocabulary, Anjin... it's "Balance".

Or do I need to remind you that we owe the fact that we are not swimming in our own pollution at the moment to people like Al Gore...

Utter nonsense.
So, before Al Gore showed up, we were all swimming in our own sludge? Don't you think this hero worship things done got a bit outta hand?

$43 billion that they don't have to invest in other activities that could be far more productive/rewarding to the people of China

Sort of like the half a billion a day we spend in Iraq.

There's this, too... as one of the commentors over there reminds us.. they hadda shut down their factories to eliminate the pollution long enough to run the games.

Since when do you care about pollution? Or do I need to remind you that we owe the fact that we are not swimming in our own pollution at the moment to people like Al Gore...