Thats interesting, because you have not provided anything along these lines...

Well, two things. First, you have this upside down.
Secondly if you are, as I suppose, sugegsting I've not given any facts and figures to that point, you clearly didn't read the link I posted.

NHTSA figures report that 64% of SUV deaths are blamed on lack of seatbelts, not of vehicle design. And of those, a sizeable number are related to tire failures, which in turn are caused by lack of tire maintenance… simply keeping the tires up to pressure, and THAT in fairly isolated cases. When those incidents are factored out, the death rates in SUV’s are actually LOWER than for the kind of tincans the left would have us in.

My Rainier certainly outhandles most of the cars I've had in my lifetime, and comes darned close to some of the sports cars I've driven

Cool lets race for pink slips...

You could, certainly, but it wouldn't sell. You'd have to show me an increased crash rate on a per mile basis, and then attach a higher fatality rate to that crash rate

Thats interesting, because you have not provided anything along these lines...

Bit, your opinion is not proof. While I agree that a Fiesta is an inferior car in every sense of the word, I think people buy them because they cannot afford better. I doubt mileage figures into it.

Oh, please. Don't you recall when the Fiesta was instroduced? It came online in reaponse to the Jimmy Carter gas crisis, and was sold on gas mileage. As did the Vega, the Escort and a few others.

In both cases I spoke of, MPG was the thurst of the argument for buying the things. There's no frame in either of them; Just a thin floorpan. No structural integrity to speak of. But boy, we're saving the planet, aren't we?

I have a neighbor down the way drives one of those things. Puts her two small kids in the back of it. I shudder every time I see that. Wouldn't take much more than a Harley to take the back half of that thing clean off.

I could easily argue that huge suvs and trucks are killing people because they are more likely to feel invulnerable in them and drive recklessly

.

You could, certainly, but it wouldn't sell. You'd have to show me an increased crash rate on a per mile basis, and then attach a higher fatality rate to that crash rate. Even you will have to admit that's a lot of 'if'.

Simply because you once saw a fatal accident, and you think a bigger car might have changed the outcome, does not prove a thing

In a former life (Snicker) I was trained as an accident investigator. I actually wanted to be a cop for a few years, there, before I got into radio in the middle 70's. I learned enough to be able to read the signs, in these cases. I know what it was I saw and how to read those signs. I have all the proof I need to make my choices.
Thanks, I choose LIFE.

Or that they have poor visibility and maneuverability, thus are more dangerous. There is probably some validity to it too

Depends how they're set up, really. Most SUV's these days, at least as they come from the factory, hand as well as any car. My Rainier certainly outhandles most of the cars I've had in my lifetime, and comes darned close to some of the sports cars I've driven. Then again, that's the All Wheel Drive (Not 4wd) and the air ride working.

The truth is that you are the flip side of the far left extremists that you despise

The truth can be pretty extreme.

Simply because you once saw a fatal accident, and you think a bigger car might have changed the outcome, does not prove a thing.

I could easily argue that huge suvs and trucks are killing people because they are more likely to feel invulnerable in them and drive recklessly. Or that they have poor visibility and maneuverability, thus are more dangerous. There is probably some validity to it too. But it is just an opinion. Try bringing some facts to the table.

The truth is that you are the flip side of the far left extremists that you despise. You are exactly like them, except that you hold views on the opposite side of the spectrum.

Bit you still have not told us how Prius' are killing people...

Mostly because I've said it often enough before.

Which leads me, finally, to a personal comment, to those of you who think small cars are “safe”.

I hesitate to say this.
Twice now, I’ve been at the scene of an accident… once where I knew the victims personally, and once where I happened upon an accident before the police arrived. Both fatal accidents, both one car accidents, and both situations where the person would have lived had they had something better than a Ford Fiesta in one case, or a Prius, in the other. In both cases, they valued a gallon of gas over their own lives, and paid the price…. And I’m left with the horrible memory of those two incidents.

I will *never* drive such a vehicle, and I don’t give a hot crap WHAT kind of gas numbers it turns in.

(i.e. the Geo Metro got similar highway mileage; but you'd never be able to get people to buy a Prius with that gas engine and no battery, because it would take 25 seconds to get up to highway speed, if ever).

anjin, you're thinking of plug-in hybrids, which have yet to make it to the real world. All of the energy in the Prius battery was created originally by burning gasoline.

We're killing people to save fuel.

Bithead, you're as ill-informed about hybrids as you are about economics. The Prius outperforms every other midsized car on the highway by a long-shot (it outperforms all mainstream cars, as a matter of fact).

You own one, I take it.

In any event, what you say may be true, but hw much of that gas mileage (I hesitate to call it performance) is the design of the remainder of the car? THe every reason I chose the vehicles I did was that there are pure gas models to draw a comparison to.

My understanding is that one of the main advantages of a Prius is that in bumper to bumper traffic it can run in a strictly electric mode, thus eliminating the use of the gasoline engine during the most inefficient type of driving. I imagine there is a big reduction in emissions as well. Of course we do have to allow for pollution involved in production of the necessary electricity.

Well, of course, many do that, or most do. I know the Tahoe does, for example. Now, what about those of us who don't spend much time in traffic, hmmm?

I'm guessing it's a couple orders of magnitude less that the # of barrels of recoverable oil * the current price of a barrel of oil.

No. Wherein lies the problem, and is why we've had such a problem with development of new fields.

Well, that's the point; At freeway speeds it doesn't turn off often, if at all. So what you end up with is an underpowered rig, that gets the same MPG was the one with the big gas or diesel engine.

My understanding is that one of the main advantages of a Prius is that in bumper to bumper traffic it can run in a strictly electric mode, thus eliminating the use of the gasoline engine during the most inefficient type of driving. I imagine there is a big reduction in emissions as well. Of course we do have to allow for pollution involved in production of the necessary electricity.

Why is the battery useful even on the highway? Because you wouldn't tolerate a car that big with a gas engine that small without the assist from the battery to accelerate up to highway speeds.

Are you aware of the costs involved with simpy getting through the governmental hoops for a new drill site, and the legal costs involved with just that? That's before one bit of equipment is moved into place.

I'm guessing it's a couple orders of magnitude less that the # of barrels of recoverable oil * the current price of a barrel of oil.

Well, let's see. No oil for Democrats? That's about 50%, isn't it? (Snort)

More like 51%.

Perhaps, but that factor is more or less offset by the added weight of the system. Which is why the OTR MPG of the Escape hybrid, for example, is somewhat lower than the OTR of the Escape straight gas rig with the smaller of the two engines.

Yes, the batteries are heavy (the "big" I mentioned several posts up). Super-capacitors will hopefully become viable in the near future, which will remove a lot of that weight.

Going from engine rotation to current to wheel rotation has a smaller heat loss than going through mechanical transmission, so you should still get better fuel economy

Perhaps, but that factor is more or less offset by the added weight of the system. Which is why the OTR MPG of the Escape hybrid, for example, is somewhat lower than the OTR of the Escape straight gas rig with the smaller of the two engines. (They released the Escape for a while with a 4cyl engine not unlike what they use in the hybrid)