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	<title>Comments on: The Monty Hall Problem:  Still Hanging Around</title>
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		<title>By: Anonymous</title>
		<link>http://www.outsidethebeltway.com/archives/the_monty_hall_problem_still_hanging_around/comment-page-1/#comment-67674</link>
		<dc:creator>Anonymous</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 12 Dec 2005 15:01:55 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.outsidethebeltway.com/?p=12818#comment-67674</guid>
		<description>&lt;strong&gt;hidden bathroom cameras&lt;/strong&gt;

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		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p><strong>hidden bathroom cameras</strong></p>
<p>threesome sex toilet cam gangbangs gangbang squad family orgies texas secretary of state gay orgy teen orgy threesome group masturbation ffm be your own boss lesbian orgy gangbang squad threesome girls pee standing up threesomes office upskirt wife thr...</p>
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		<title>By: floyd</title>
		<link>http://www.outsidethebeltway.com/archives/the_monty_hall_problem_still_hanging_around/comment-page-1/#comment-66823</link>
		<dc:creator>floyd</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sun, 04 Dec 2005 17:15:59 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.outsidethebeltway.com/?p=12818#comment-66823</guid>
		<description>focus; the question was motive.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>focus; the question was motive.</p>
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		<title>By: Steve Verdon</title>
		<link>http://www.outsidethebeltway.com/archives/the_monty_hall_problem_still_hanging_around/comment-page-1/#comment-66801</link>
		<dc:creator>Steve Verdon</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sun, 04 Dec 2005 04:15:18 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.outsidethebeltway.com/?p=12818#comment-66801</guid>
		<description>Really?  My co-worker bought some Valero a while ago when it was cheap, not it is worth something like 6x what he paid for it.  So, you&#039;ll have to forgive me if I don&#039;t subsribe to this notion that the stockholders are getting screwed.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Really?  My co-worker bought some Valero a while ago when it was cheap, not it is worth something like 6x what he paid for it.  So, you'll have to forgive me if I don't subsribe to this notion that the stockholders are getting screwed.</p>
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		<title>By: floyd</title>
		<link>http://www.outsidethebeltway.com/archives/the_monty_hall_problem_still_hanging_around/comment-page-1/#comment-66747</link>
		<dc:creator>floyd</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sat, 03 Dec 2005 03:12:44 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.outsidethebeltway.com/?p=12818#comment-66747</guid>
		<description>steve, down in the face of recent escalating margins short term , with miserable dividends. overall profitable long term 30+ years, but not to a degree to make me believe the stockholders are their primary concern of late. i admit that my position is based on knowing the people in the field. i also am no economist and i understand there are many mitigating factors of which i am unaware.   a reasonably intelligent person can sometimes know when he&#039;s being hoodwinked without knowing the exact method employed.to quote my old algebra teacher,&quot; you know son, liars may figger, but figgers don&#039;t lie&quot;.  because the issue is so complex i am left only with what i consider good reason to question [not define] their motives.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>steve, down in the face of recent escalating margins short term , with miserable dividends. overall profitable long term 30+ years, but not to a degree to make me believe the stockholders are their primary concern of late. i admit that my position is based on knowing the people in the field. i also am no economist and i understand there are many mitigating factors of which i am unaware.   a reasonably intelligent person can sometimes know when he's being hoodwinked without knowing the exact method employed.to quote my old algebra teacher," you know son, liars may figger, but figgers don't lie".  because the issue is so complex i am left only with what i consider good reason to question [not define] their motives.</p>
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		<title>By: Steve Verdon</title>
		<link>http://www.outsidethebeltway.com/archives/the_monty_hall_problem_still_hanging_around/comment-page-1/#comment-66677</link>
		<dc:creator>Steve Verdon</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 02 Dec 2005 17:36:12 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.outsidethebeltway.com/?p=12818#comment-66677</guid>
		<description>floyd,

So the stock for these companies has gone down then?</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>floyd,</p>
<p>So the stock for these companies has gone down then?</p>
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		<title>By: floyd</title>
		<link>http://www.outsidethebeltway.com/archives/the_monty_hall_problem_still_hanging_around/comment-page-1/#comment-66593</link>
		<dc:creator>floyd</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 02 Dec 2005 03:16:03 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.outsidethebeltway.com/?p=12818#comment-66593</guid>
		<description>RJN; i must take issue with your statement that the officers of private corporations just want to make a buck for their stockholders. in the case of big oil ,with whom i have a long standing relationship, they have made obscene profits for some time now. almost none of said profit has gone to stockholders, nonexecutive employees, or even capital improvement. there was a time when these officers clearly were motivated as you ascribe;however an unjaundiced eye would question whether that is presently the case.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>RJN; i must take issue with your statement that the officers of private corporations just want to make a buck for their stockholders. in the case of big oil ,with whom i have a long standing relationship, they have made obscene profits for some time now. almost none of said profit has gone to stockholders, nonexecutive employees, or even capital improvement. there was a time when these officers clearly were motivated as you ascribe;however an unjaundiced eye would question whether that is presently the case.</p>
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		<title>By: physics geek</title>
		<link>http://www.outsidethebeltway.com/archives/the_monty_hall_problem_still_hanging_around/comment-page-1/#comment-66490</link>
		<dc:creator>physics geek</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 01 Dec 2005 04:47:47 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.outsidethebeltway.com/?p=12818#comment-66490</guid>
		<description>Painful comments?  I believe that I included the very same probability proof as you, albeit without the fancy mathematical nomenclature.

People will argue this one with me until they&#039;re blue in the face, but after empirically testing the hypothesis, they always come around.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Painful comments?  I believe that I included the very same probability proof as you, albeit without the fancy mathematical nomenclature.</p>
<p>People will argue this one with me until they're blue in the face, but after empirically testing the hypothesis, they always come around.</p>
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		<title>By: RJN</title>
		<link>http://www.outsidethebeltway.com/archives/the_monty_hall_problem_still_hanging_around/comment-page-1/#comment-66483</link>
		<dc:creator>RJN</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 01 Dec 2005 03:47:09 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.outsidethebeltway.com/?p=12818#comment-66483</guid>
		<description>Dill:  I tried the simple fewer words several times on my friend without success. Eventually I went to the lengthier explanation, with a confirmation at each step of the way, to cement understanding.

You really have to try to explain this to someone and then you will understand why the need for extra words.

Herb:  I may be a bad boy; I am not sure yet. I assumed that you were railing at some imaginary malfeasance by officers of private corporations because they like to make a buck for their stockholders.

Attempting to place oil executives under oath in a committee hearing was a stupid, and insulting publicity stunt by the Dumbocrats. They were only interested in pictures for their MSN toadies.

Long playing government bungling has led to the sad plight of the Airline Industry. We all regret the upheavals energy cost, and increased safety costs has brought. 

However, the unions are not blameless. They have priced themselves out of the affordable range of the airlines. Union pension and health care costs, are way above the norm for wage earning and non-government salary earning America.

I thought you were swinging like a bloke, so I called you a bloke. Being a bloke is not bad; being rude may be. If you were not railing, then I was wrong to assume you were.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Dill:  I tried the simple fewer words several times on my friend without success. Eventually I went to the lengthier explanation, with a confirmation at each step of the way, to cement understanding.</p>
<p>You really have to try to explain this to someone and then you will understand why the need for extra words.</p>
<p>Herb:  I may be a bad boy; I am not sure yet. I assumed that you were railing at some imaginary malfeasance by officers of private corporations because they like to make a buck for their stockholders.</p>
<p>Attempting to place oil executives under oath in a committee hearing was a stupid, and insulting publicity stunt by the Dumbocrats. They were only interested in pictures for their MSN toadies.</p>
<p>Long playing government bungling has led to the sad plight of the Airline Industry. We all regret the upheavals energy cost, and increased safety costs has brought. </p>
<p>However, the unions are not blameless. They have priced themselves out of the affordable range of the airlines. Union pension and health care costs, are way above the norm for wage earning and non-government salary earning America.</p>
<p>I thought you were swinging like a bloke, so I called you a bloke. Being a bloke is not bad; being rude may be. If you were not railing, then I was wrong to assume you were.</p>
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		<title>By: Rodney Dill</title>
		<link>http://www.outsidethebeltway.com/archives/the_monty_hall_problem_still_hanging_around/comment-page-1/#comment-66474</link>
		<dc:creator>Rodney Dill</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 01 Dec 2005 02:48:37 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.outsidethebeltway.com/?p=12818#comment-66474</guid>
		<description>RJN, yep it&#039;s the same solution, these are all pretty much different ways of paraphrasing the solution. I just chopped it down to fewer words enough to annoy Steve and have him label it &#039;elegant&#039;  &lt;i&gt;woo hoo  ;)&lt;/i&gt;  

As I said earlier I saw this at Dean&#039;s World in what was probably late 2002 or early 2003. To finally convince myself that solution of switching was correct I had to change my belief to being that switching was correct,  instead of trying to prove it wrong. The million door selection analogy also helped me visualize the problem.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>RJN, yep it's the same solution, these are all pretty much different ways of paraphrasing the solution. I just chopped it down to fewer words enough to annoy Steve and have him label it 'elegant'  <i>woo hoo  ;)</i>  </p>
<p>As I said earlier I saw this at Dean's World in what was probably late 2002 or early 2003. To finally convince myself that solution of switching was correct I had to change my belief to being that switching was correct,  instead of trying to prove it wrong. The million door selection analogy also helped me visualize the problem.</p>
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		<title>By: Herb</title>
		<link>http://www.outsidethebeltway.com/archives/the_monty_hall_problem_still_hanging_around/comment-page-1/#comment-66472</link>
		<dc:creator>Herb</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 01 Dec 2005 02:43:45 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.outsidethebeltway.com/?p=12818#comment-66472</guid>
		<description>RJN:

Wow RJN, What is a &quot;bloke&quot;. You must be a liney or an Ausse. If you would have bothered to read my comment, you would know that the so called &quot;market forces&quot; is what I was commenting about. Perhaps what you did read just didn&#039;t sink in and that is ok with me, but next time, reply with a comment that would provide a reasonable answer.  

As for the last part of your comment, again, you don&#039;t know what the hell you are talking about and your guessing leaves a lot to be desired. And for your information, I am retired from many years in the Airline Industry that is not supported by the taxpayer. The tax supported airlines and aircraft manufacturers are common in the EU. Not Here Bloke.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>RJN:</p>
<p>Wow RJN, What is a "bloke". You must be a liney or an Ausse. If you would have bothered to read my comment, you would know that the so called "market forces" is what I was commenting about. Perhaps what you did read just didn't sink in and that is ok with me, but next time, reply with a comment that would provide a reasonable answer.  </p>
<p>As for the last part of your comment, again, you don't know what the hell you are talking about and your guessing leaves a lot to be desired. And for your information, I am retired from many years in the Airline Industry that is not supported by the taxpayer. The tax supported airlines and aircraft manufacturers are common in the EU. Not Here Bloke.</p>
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		<title>By: RJN</title>
		<link>http://www.outsidethebeltway.com/archives/the_monty_hall_problem_still_hanging_around/comment-page-1/#comment-66463</link>
		<dc:creator>RJN</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 01 Dec 2005 01:59:15 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.outsidethebeltway.com/?p=12818#comment-66463</guid>
		<description>I think I gave the &quot;Monty gives you two doors solution&quot; above at comment #5.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I think I gave the "Monty gives you two doors solution" above at comment #5.</p>
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		<title>By: James Joyner</title>
		<link>http://www.outsidethebeltway.com/archives/the_monty_hall_problem_still_hanging_around/comment-page-1/#comment-66462</link>
		<dc:creator>James Joyner</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 01 Dec 2005 01:55:07 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.outsidethebeltway.com/?p=12818#comment-66462</guid>
		<description>Rodney/Steve:

But don&#039;t you get both doors either way?  That is, Monty&#039;s giving you one free door plus either your original door or another.  Either way, you know the &quot;new&quot; door doesn&#039;t have the prize.

I know this works mathematically but this explanation doesn&#039;t help make it more intuitive.

Amusingly, when I played around at the Java site linked in the comments above, it took me well over forty iterations to finally get behind by sticking to my original every time and I got bored before I fell below 44%.  Their &lt;a href=&quot;http://www.shawnolson.net/a/785/&quot;&gt;explanation&lt;/a&gt; is similar to Rodney&#039;s:

&lt;blockquote&gt;Assume that the dealer does not show you the one losing card. In that case, the dealer is saying to you, âKeep your card or choose the other two cards.â Even though you know it canât be both of those cards, you know there is a 66 percent chance that you will win by switching.&lt;/blockquote&gt;

That&#039;s of course true.  

</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Rodney/Steve:</p>
<p>But don't you get both doors either way?  That is, Monty's giving you one free door plus either your original door or another.  Either way, you know the "new" door doesn't have the prize.</p>
<p>I know this works mathematically but this explanation doesn't help make it more intuitive.</p>
<p>Amusingly, when I played around at the Java site linked in the comments above, it took me well over forty iterations to finally get behind by sticking to my original every time and I got bored before I fell below 44%.  Their <a href="http://www.shawnolson.net/a/785/">explanation</a> is similar to Rodney's:</p>
<blockquote><p>Assume that the dealer does not show you the one losing card. In that case, the dealer is saying to you, âKeep your card or choose the other two cards.â Even though you know it canât be both of those cards, you know there is a 66 percent chance that you will win by switching.</p></blockquote>
<p>That's of course true.</p>
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		<title>By: Steve Verdon</title>
		<link>http://www.outsidethebeltway.com/archives/the_monty_hall_problem_still_hanging_around/comment-page-1/#comment-66457</link>
		<dc:creator>Steve Verdon</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 01 Dec 2005 00:06:35 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.outsidethebeltway.com/?p=12818#comment-66457</guid>
		<description>Rodney,

Dang it!  How dare you come up with an elegant way of explaining the problem.

&lt;em&gt;grumble, grumble, mutter, mutter&lt;/em&gt;</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Rodney,</p>
<p>Dang it!  How dare you come up with an elegant way of explaining the problem.</p>
<p><em>grumble, grumble, mutter, mutter</em></p>
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		<title>By: Rodney Dill</title>
		<link>http://www.outsidethebeltway.com/archives/the_monty_hall_problem_still_hanging_around/comment-page-1/#comment-66453</link>
		<dc:creator>Rodney Dill</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 30 Nov 2005 23:42:05 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.outsidethebeltway.com/?p=12818#comment-66453</guid>
		<description>Another way to look at it is you keep the original door, or you get to choose both of the other doors. 
The fact that Monty opens the one that has to be empty is inconsequential.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Another way to look at it is you keep the original door, or you get to choose both of the other doors.<br />
The fact that Monty opens the one that has to be empty is inconsequential.</p>
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		<title>By: Steve Verdon</title>
		<link>http://www.outsidethebeltway.com/archives/the_monty_hall_problem_still_hanging_around/comment-page-1/#comment-66447</link>
		<dc:creator>Steve Verdon</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 30 Nov 2005 23:16:32 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.outsidethebeltway.com/?p=12818#comment-66447</guid>
		<description>Herb,

Actually it does matter.  Most people just don&#039;t get this at first (some never ever get it).  It highlights that people are not rational when it comes to evlauation of probabilities...this applies to real life not just game shows.  Such as insurance policies, investing, and so forth.  The game show example, is just a cute way of showing that most people don&#039;t think according to the laws of probability.

Deskmerc,

Dang, I should have googled for such website.  Nice find.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Herb,</p>
<p>Actually it does matter.  Most people just don't get this at first (some never ever get it).  It highlights that people are not rational when it comes to evlauation of probabilities...this applies to real life not just game shows.  Such as insurance policies, investing, and so forth.  The game show example, is just a cute way of showing that most people don't think according to the laws of probability.</p>
<p>Deskmerc,</p>
<p>Dang, I should have googled for such website.  Nice find.</p>
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