Donald Trump Calls For Ban On All Muslim Immigration
Donald J. Trump continues to turn the dial higher and higher on his fascist demagoguery.
Seemingly intent on proving the assertions of those of his critics who have called him a fascist and a demagogue, as well as a racist among other things, Donald Trump is doubling down on his recent anti-Muslim rhetoric by calling for a complete ban on all Muslim immigration into the United States:
Donald J. Trump called on Monday for the United States to bar all Muslims from entering the country until the nation’s leaders can “figure out what is going on,” an extraordinary escalation of his harsh rhetoric aimed at members of the Islamic faith in the aftermath of the terrorist attacks in Paris and San Bernardino, Calif.
“Without looking at the various polling data, it is obvious to anybody the hatred is beyond comprehension. Where this hatred comes from and why we will have to determine,” said Mr. Trump, the leading Republican candidate for his party’s 2016 presidential nomination.
“Until we are able to determine and understand this problem and the dangerous threat it poses, our country cannot be the victims of horrendous attacks by people that believe only in jihad, and have no sense of reason or respect for human life,” he said.
A spokeswoman for Mr. Trump confirmed the authenticity of the statement. Asked what prompted it, Mr. Trump said, “death,” according to the spokeswoman.
Here’s the full statement that was sent to reporters:
Full statement from @realDonaldTrump on stopping Muslims entering US pic.twitter.com/AjG7wPlUmI
— Laura Bicker (@BBCLBicker) December 7, 2015
The Hill reports that Trump’s campaign says that his proposal would include barring American citizens who are overseas from returning home:
Republican presidential front-runner Donald Trump wants to bar all Muslims from entering the United States.
In a statement from his campaign, Trump called for a “total and complete shutdown” of Muslims entering the United States until elected leaders can “figure out what is going on.”
When asked by The Hill whether that would include Muslim-American citizens currently abroad, Trump spokeswoman Hope Hicks replied over email: “Mr. Trump says, ‘everyone.'”
Trump is quoted in the statement as saying that a significant number of Muslims harbor a “hatred” toward America and as a result should be kept out of the country.
He backed that up with a poll by the Center for Security Policy, a think-tank that has criticized the role of Muslims in America.
That poll showed that one-quarter of Muslims living in America polled “agreed that violence against Americans here in the United States is justified as part of the global jihad” and that a majority think that Muslims in America should be allowed to answer to Shariah law.
“Without looking at the various polling data, it is obvious to anybody the hatred is beyond comprehension. Where this hatred comes from and why we will have to determine,” Trump said.
“Until we are able to determine and understand this problem and the dangerous threat it poses, our country cannot be the victims of horrendous attacks by people that believe only in Jihad, and have no sense of reason or respect for human life.”
The Washington Post’s Philip Bump has a post up pointing out the inherent flaws in the poll of Muslim-Americans that Trump is citing in support of his argument, but such evidence is hardly going to matter to his supporters. Much like his comments about Mexicans, or other examples of outrageous rhetoric on his part that have been well-cataloged at this point, the overwhelming likelihood is that they will instead rally around him just as they have in the past. Indeed, there seems to be nothing that Trump can do or say that would dissuade these people from supporting him. As I have said mostly in jest on social media more than once in recent months, Donald Trump could perform an abortion on a woman dressed as the Virgin Mary in a Church on Christmas Eve at midnight and broadcast it live to the world and these people would still love him. For many of them, this has become a cult of personality, and that is quite troublesome.
Given the fact that, in the three weeks since the Paris attacks Trump has engaged in seemingly non-stop anti-Muslim rhetoric in the name of fighting “terrorism,” this is hardly surprising. Since November 13th, for example, Trump has advocated closing mosques and maintaining a database to track Muslim-Americans and Muslim immigrants, constantly repeated debunked claims that “thousands” of Muslim Americans were celebrating the destruction of the World Trade Center on September 11, 2001, and in the wake of the San Bernardino attacks has increased his anti-Muslim rhetoric to an even higher level. This new statement, which comes just hours before his next big campaign rally in South Carolina during which he will apparently talking about this “idea,” is in some sense just a continuation of the hate and demagoguery that has been a staple of the Trump campaign for months now, and which only seems to make him more popular with his supporters if the fact that he continues to lead in the polls at both the national and state level is any indication. In any case, it seems likely that this latest proposal is one that his most loyal supporters in particular are going to love, what will be interesting will be to see how the other Republican candidates react to this idea over the coming days. The fact that Trump released this statement mere hours after I wrote about the dangers of the rise of anti-Muslim rhetoric in the wake of Paris and San Beranrdino just seems to prove the arguments I made that post correct.
As for the merits of Trump proposal, there really aren’t any worthy of being discussed. For one thing, Syed Farook, one of the two San Bernardino shooters was born in the United States and his parents appear to have entered this countries many years before he was born, so proposing to ban immigration based on what happened in San Bernardino is absurd since such an idea would have done nothing to stop Farook from acting on his own even if it might have prevented his wife from entering the country. Beyond the practical arguments, though, it would seem as though a complete ban on immigration based solely on someone’s religious beliefs is something that would be a violation of the First Amendment as well as other parts of the Constitution. It’s true that there isn’t necessarily a Constitutional right for an immigrant to enter the country, but a law that bars people based on categories such as religious beliefs would strike me as being clearly unconstitutional. Of course, Trump isn’t proposing this idea as something he seriously believes will become law, especially since it is exceedingly unlikely that Donald Trump will ever become President. Most likely, it’s just the latest example of a campaign strategy that seems to involve saying more and more outrageous things and then sitting back and watching as the media gives him free media time that only serves to increase his poll numbers. It is a strategy that has worked exceedingly well so far, unfortunately, and it will likely work this time as well.
The most notable thing about Trump’s statement, of course, is that it is the latest, and arguably one of the worst, examples of the extent to which he has built a campaign around the idea of appealing to the worst aspects of American politics. It’s also another exhibit in favor of the argument that it is entirely appropriate to consider the man to be a fascist and a demagogue, and indeed just somewhat dangerous as a political figure. That danger is enhanced, though, by the fact that he is the leading Republican candidate for President at the national level as well as in all of the early states such as Iowa, New Hampshire, South Carolina, and Florida. If he were saying these things while polling in the single digits or barely showing up in the polls at all, it would be easy to simply dismiss him and move along. The fact that he is in fact leading the race and could, very plausibly at this point, end up being the Republican nominee for President says nothing good about the state of politics in our country, or more importantly about the state of the Republican Party. Indeed, as I said over the weekend, if Trump does end up winning the GOP nomination, I fear I’m going to lose respect for a lot of people I consider friends or at least people that I can have reasonable disagreements and rational discussions with. Even though I couldn’t support them myself and ended up voting Libertarian, I could understand why people decided to support and vote for a candidate like John McCain or Mitt Romney. I cannot for the life of me understand why any rational human being, and especially anyone who claims to support limited government and individual rights, could support Donald Trump just because he has an R after his name and he won the nomination of his party. If this statement doesn’t lead more Republicans to reject Trump’s hateful rhetoric, and to reject him, then the GOP is headed for trouble in 2016.
He hasn’t held Iowa since the Carson surge, and now Cruz holds a slim lead there. Which isn’t that comforting given Cruz is a poor man’s Trump, but it’s something to cling to.
“…it is exceedingly unlikely that Donald Trump will ever become President” has become a calming mantra for commentators more than a factual statement though.
For everybody in favor of “taking action” using executive orders, consider two words: President Trump.
Doug,
You have “…especially since it is exceedingly unlikely that Donald Trump will ever become President.”
followed by
“… he is the leading Republican candidate for President at the national level as well as in all of the early states…‘
I don’t think “exceedingly unlikely” means what you think it means.
I hate to break it to you but the prion disease* eating away at the brains of the Republican base is going full bore and it’s only going to get worse.
I don’t expect Trump to get the nomination and I don’t expect him to win if he did, but so far I have been 100% wrong on every one of my Trump predictions.
If there’s more domestic Islamic terrorism, even small bore attacks, Trump could potentially win.
*Charles Pierce, Esquire.
A registry of Muslims. Special identification for Muslims. Constant surveillance of Muslims. And now barring all Muslims, even American citizens, entry into the country.
An American Presidential candidate is advocating the same measures that led directly to the Holocaust.
And instead of recoiling in horror from this blatant, undisguised descent into fascism, Americans are catapulting this thug to the top.
I weep for our nation.
I call for a ban on all Trumps, including those currently in this country. Seriously, this is beyond disgusting.
I tried to say on an earlier thread today that one is 20 times more likely to get struck by lightning (never mind killed) than die in a terrorist attack.Really… America? Adult diapers on sale in aisle 3.
@Tillman:
What polls are you looking at? RCP has Trump up 5 points in Iowa.
http://www.realclearpolitics.com/epolls/2016/president/ia/iowa_republican_presidential_caucus-3194.html
Well, what can you say? We’ve reached that point in our descent into Idiocracy where this is a leading candidate for one of the two parties’ national nomination. Yikes.
Trump, whose experience with immigration consists perhaps of talking up Kimba Wood’s travails at a cocktail party or two, between ski vacaycay’s at Vail, actually released that statement? Wow. Not just young men ages 15-50 to be profiled and then provisionally blocked, which would of course be a no brainer everywhere but in cabernet and art house circles, but a blanket ban on all Muslims? Not Kosher even by right-wing moonbattery standards.
If Trump somehow gets the nod then the Hillary-Trump contest next year will be in essence the final nail in the coffin. It’ll be a choice between President Kardashian and President Huey Long Friedan Vanden Huevel.
We’re doomed.
@OzarkHillbilly:
The Ebola Panic was a good harbinger of what we are seeing now.
That whole Southern Strategy thing is turning out well.
@Bill Lefrak: The Tsar: a real-life human being, or Turing-bot built to embody the Dunning–Kruger effect? We report, you decide?
This Trumpism is why trying to play the GOP at the irrational panic game is a loser for Democrats- in the end, the demagogue will always out-demagogue you. If you are lucky, he burns himself out before real damage is done..
@humanoid.panda:
I’m also curious as to which one he thinks President Kardashian is and which one President Huey Long is. That would go a long way to figuring out your question.
Still more ignorance and bigotry from this national joke and embarrassment….
ISIS can lay off everyone they have working on recruiting. Trump is doing their work for them…
@MikeSJ:
Yep. When exactly did we turn into a nation of chickenshits?
Maybe Rubio will save us from this national nightmare…
Wait, what’s that? He’s in 4th place? Well nevermind then.
(Just popped over the RCP to find out how far back Rubio is. Man, what a cess pool of stupidity the right has become. To a man, they seem to think Obama is the biggest problem when it comes to Islamic terrorism. WTF? I mean, there’s plenty of room to criticize, but the American right is waaaaay more interested in fighting Obama than they are ISIS. Where among all these editorials condemning Obama can I find the one that condemns ISIS?)
@Davebo: Monmouth University poll, which is factored into the RCP average. They’re also including a CNN/ORC poll that has Trump dominating by 13 points which seems like an outlier to me given Iowa’s evangelical voting base.
Just a correction: Trump is not talking about banning Muslim immigration, he is talking about banning Muslims from ENTERING the United States. That includes tourists on visitor´s visa and people with students visa. I don´t know about Americans that are Muslims that are returning home.
@Andre Kenji:
Maybe we will have some kind of camps for them. We will have to come up with a name for these camps…
What did Malcolm say about the chickens coming home to roost? Reagan and the Republican Party got in bed with the hard core bigots when he launched his 1980 presidential campaign in Philedelphia , Mississippi. Thirty five years later, the bastard stepchild of Reagan is leading for the nomination of the current Party, saying stuff even George Wallace wouldn’t try on.
I’m watching MSNBC, and the no2 Republican candidate Ted Cruz refused to condemn him , so he is still looking to get Trump’s followers.
Frankly, the problem really isn’t so much Trump, but the base the Republicans have cultivated these 35 years and who is primed to respond to this rhetoric.
@anjin-san:
Trump Guard Tower would be appropriate. Personally, I’m bullish on prison camp REIT stocks.
At this point, a Trump Republican nomination truly destroys the Republican party. I understand that since 2008, people on the left have been foretelling of the GOP’s demise, but with a Trump nomination, how does the GOP avoid a complete implosion?
The reaction from his speech today has been–across the board–one of disbelief. Even Fox News (Edit: link below) is in disbelief. Can any Republican and/or Conservative explain to me how Trump can run on a message of outright and complete xenophobia?
You have to remember, the Republican Party (like the Democratic Party) only comprises approximately 25% of the American voting electorate. A Trump nomination will absolutely come from either a brokered convention or a bare majority of primaries.* This means that AT MOST roughly 12% of America supports his fascistic ideology. Every Republican Senator, Governor, and Representative will be asked, repeatedly, whether he/she supports the policies of their party’s candidate. If there answer is “No,” well then what is their campaign? To go to Washington to fight against their own President? If their answer is yes, see above regarding the 12% ceiling.
So how do Republicans win, outside of the most racistly gerrymandered districts? Even with those, we’re still only talking about, what, 40-50% of the south’s districts, and 20-40% or so of the west and plain states (really depends on the state). That’s a rump party status–one that affects down ballot races in a very real way.
The Republicans–the party of Lincoln, Roosevelt, Eisenhower, Reagan–will be effectively dead.
*This is not to discount that he could win. Reynolds has convincingly laid out the polling numbers–Carson/Cruz/Trump make up 50% of the party. But that other 50% include what’s left of the sane Republicans, neocons, the money wing–they’ll not go down without a fight. Not to mention all the swing state parties with Senators and Reps they want to return to DC. Ohio is already openingly discussing a strategy of condemning Trump. Despite the polls, this is not Trump’s race to mop up yet.
http://www.foxnews.com/politics/2015/12/07/trump-calls-for-complete-shutdown-on-muslims-entering-us.html
And there you have it, ladies and gentlemen…a not insignificant portion of the population thinks the President of the United States is a greater threat to the American people than a foreign terrorist group…and that portion of people is now coalescing around some blowhard Il Duce wannabe…
What’s more, racism and xenophobia aside, what type of governing ideology is this?
“When I’m President, and there is any sort of medium to major emergency, my plan will be to stop everything and then figure it out. Because that’s how emergencies work.”
Let’s think this through.
1. If the current threat of terrorism is truly a danger to the existence of the US,
2. And if that threat emanates from a defined group,
3. Why exactly should you not take decisive action to protect the country from that group?
Everybody’s beating up on Trump but this proposal is a relatively logical extension of the perpetual fear-mongering of “radical Islam.” I’m not sure Trump can be blamed for simply following the lead of politicians and intellectuals who hysterically exaggerate the current danger to make themselves feel more important.
Mike
@Neil Hudelson:
I’m watching Trump lay out his anti-Muslim proposal -to cheering crowds in South Carolina.They might as well just go ahead and start yelling, “Seig Heil.”
Really, Trump is a problem for the so called “good Republicans” like Joyner and Mataconis. Do they follow their tribal loyalties or do they vote against this perversion of a Republican Party leader for the good of the Country. This is something all the “good Republicans” should start thinking about. Seriously thinking about.
I didn’t read the article, but a week or two ago Slate was calling for GWB as the voice of reason. And I actually agree, but how did we get to this point?
@Mikey:
Yes….. I have to say I am genuinely startled.
The measures proposed and rhetoric being used is a direct echo of the inter-war anti-Jewish rhetoric.
US is walking towards a dangerous place to have such normalized in any fashion.
It’s fascinating to read comments about Trump invoking “hysteria” “chickenshit” ” stupid” as if the absurdity of his comments is some deep insight. I might add, invoked by people apparently here 12+ hours a day commenting with, well, hysteria, stupidity and sky is falling proclamations.
Now THATS entertainment.
For the record, the majority of pols and media types alike I’ve seen have come out against Trump, including a certain D Cheney. So there you have it. You guys are in league with Dick Cheney.
Now, back to your self congratulatory circle jerk. And I sure hope Trump doesn’t run into noted defender of free speech, Loretta Lynch…….
At Customs and Immigration booths, agents will now be asking for passports and religion ID cards ???
@Andre Kenji:
His campaign clarified that yes, he means everyone, even American citizens abroad.
@stonetools:
This is why the anonymous ballot is so important, right? Even Republicans whose careers depend on publicly backing their candidate can privately vote their conscience. I imagine a Trump nomination would mean overt neutrality from a good chunk of Republican leadership, and very half-hearted support from another big chunk.
That’s funny coming from someone who seems to hang out here a lot himself…
IMO it’s the cheering crowds that are reinforcing his repugnant policy that are particularily alarming.
In the midst of those crowds there are a few that are sufficiently mentally disabled that will take action on their own to punish innocent Muslims, and feel completely justified.
A few people today have suggested that he suddenly realizes he might actually win which is the last thing he wants. He is trying to sabotage his own campaign. This was never a serious attempt by Trump to get elected but just an ego building exercise. The other Republicans in the race are not taking him on as is the media.
@MBunge: I see your point, but one of the features of logic is that the propositions have to be true in order for it to work.
At this point, it doesn’t matter. He has proven that a significant proportion of Americans are Nazi wannabes. That’s the crisis; not Trump.
@Mikey: Indeed they are eagerly posting pictures dehumanizing Muslims on facebook and twitter galore. Some of the graphics are damned near parallels of those used against the Jews prior to Hitler’s rise.
@anjin-san: He can just use the same camps he’s using to hold the immigrants…
You know, people give fascism a bad name by lumping it in with Nazi racial ideology. Pinochet was a fascist, as well as Generalissimo Francisco Franco, and neither of them had the same virulent strain of xenophobia that led to the Nazis committing genocide. I’m not saying Fascism is good, but it isn’t the Fascism that made the Nazis as bad as they were.
If Trump were merely a fascist, well, that would be a little concerning and all, but nothing truly horrible.
Trump is worse. Trump has the xenophobia, and the willingness to use it to appeal to the worst aspects of humanity with little regard for the consequences (and that is if we are willing to give him the benefit of the doubt).
@James Pearce:
In a sense, this isn’t new. I remember a political cartoon I saw back in the 90s. An elephant wearing a GOP button finds a magic lamp, rubs it, and a genie comes out. The genie says, “I can grant you one wish. I can either rid the world of Slobodan Milosevic, or rid the world of Bill Clinton.”
The next panel has the elephant scratching its head.
The final panel has the annoyed genie saying, “Well? What will it be?” and the elephant replies, “I’m thinking, I’m thinking!”
@anjin-san: I wish I could laugh at your post. Instead, I want to cry.
How about a ban on illegal immigration ? I would think that most everyone would agree with that.
@Ron Beasley: @Ron Beasley: I have been thinking the same thing about Trump, but what alarms me is his rhetoric radicalizing his supporters.
Trump is proof of Momma Gump’s advice: “Stupid is as stupid does”. Wouldn’t surprise me to learn he owns a factory that makes red crescent patches
I heard Joe Scarborough going on this morning about how we can’t possibly defeat radicalized Muslims without the support of the Muslim community. If Joe Scarborough, widely recognized as dumber than dirt, can see that your idea is stupid…
Seems a long, long time since anjin-San was mocking Sean Hannity about soooo wanting this to be terrorism.
Heh. Seems soooo long since anjin-San soooo didn’t want it to be.
@Neil Hudelson: The same sort of mentality that looks at a half-way overturned barge in an estuary and says “I sure hope the tide doesn’t come in.”
(My college roommate enshrines that as the stupidest statement she’s ever heard, bar none.)
@Tyrell: Um, considering that a sizable percentage of illegal immigrants are people who came in on a visa and overstayed their visas, how do you propose to pick such people out when they approach immigration? Put tracking devices on all visitors until they exit the US?
(I’m quite sure that’s the next suggestion we’ll have out of the Donald. Or even more likely, shut down all entries into the country, period.)
@Guarneri: If you don’t see that the support that Trump is getting for his xenophobic statements is worrying, you don’t have a brain in your head.
Ask no further how the Germans went goose-stepping down the path to the Third Reich. Maybe the people who should REALLY be loading up on arms and ammunition are the Muslims–which will then be used as an excuse for further freaking out by the Trumpenproletariat.
@Guarneri:
Of course it was domestic terrorism, just like the Robert Dear abortion clinic terrorist attack.
Whats your point?
@Tillman: It is not really a big comfort that the candidates Iowa Republicans might prefer over Donald Trump are Ben Carson and Ted Cruz..
Yeah….vote Republican!!!!
I can accept that a presidential candidate uses that kind of rhetoric. Just barely but, OK. What horrifies me are the number of people who support him – apparently enthusiastically. I try very, very hard to avoid going Godwin but, “Seig heil”, y’all.
Don’t think that he really expected or wanted to be president going into this but wonder if his drive to win has kicked in.
@Grewgills: “His campaign clarified that yes, he means everyone, even American citizens abroad.”
Returning US soldiers?
@gVOR08: But of course Squint has been going on for months about President Obama’s and Hilary Clinton’s failure to use the preferred terminology of right wing, Neo-conservative, talking classes “War with Radical Islam.” Now he and the rest are faced with the logical consequence of that treating an entire world religion as a a potential enemy and spreading that idea among the Republican multitude in Donald Trump.
Terrorism, like an occasional mass shooting by a simple nut (since White, Christian guys can never be terrorists), especially when carried out with the same means and ends a mass shooting are impossible to stop. (Strangely, no one think James Holmes, a philosophy graduate student, need outside help to assemble his arsenal and pipe bombs for the Aurora Movie Theater massacre.) If one or two people go down that rabbit hole, well, in American society one can drive 3 miles from my house and buy semi-automatic rifles and pistols and plenty of ammunition and black powder on Visa card. http://prospect.org/article/terrorism-truths-no-politician-will-admit
@C. Clavin: You have to remember to a large numbers of Trumps supporters, most African Americans are covert Muslims now.
@Grewgills:
Yup: http://thehill.com/blogs/ballot-box/presidential-races/262348-trump-calls-for-shutdown-of-muslims-entering-us
I really want to see the follow-up about US military deployed overseas and whether we should allow them back in. smh
What we need is a database of Trump supporters. Someone needs to be watching these people. I’m much more frightened of them than any Muslims.
How crazy is Donald Trump? He’s making Lindsay Graham and Ted Cruz sound like the voice of reason.
@Hal_10000:
But wait until Cruz gets the nomination and everyone gets a load of his proposed 19% Federal sales tax.
Cruz is even more un-electable than Trump…if you can believe that.
@SKI: According to this item, Trump told Fox News’ Greta van Susteren his proposed ban would exempt American Muslims serving in the military overseas, allowing them to return to the U. S.
All along I assumed Trump was just saying stuff off the cuff that he thought people wanted to hear, not necessarily things he personal believed. But when he made fun of the reporter’s disability and re-tweeted the made-up racist crime statistics (both occurring in the same week), I started to think that he 1. he really believed this crap and 2. he’s started to unravel. Now with the Muslim ban, he’s completely lost it. If he doesn’t win, what does he do? The only long-term business success he has ever had is marketing his brand. Now his brand is radioactive. What company would partner with Trump? I could even imagine that a network would balk at televising a PGA tournament played at one of his golf courses. I wouldn’t patronize a store that carried any of his products.
@Mikey: How white of him…
In a weird way, I’m glad Trump is acting out, as it lances the boil somewhat; puts it out there front and centre for the country to respond to. What that response will be we will have to wait and see but I’d be fairly confident that outside of the fever swamps most Americans understand that to give ISIS what it wants (the means to portray the US as hateful of all Muslims) makes no sense. We made that mistake before by giving Bin Laden what he wanted and look what we got in return. The desire for revenge by US Citizens was to be expected, but smarter people would have avoided feeding it, much as Obama is attempting to do now.
There’s just no easy fix for what’s happening in the Middle East at the moment. All-out war won’t do it, nor will pulling the shutters down. Maybe we just have to let this regional conflict play itself out and protect ourselves as best we can without destroying the ideals successive generations have sacrificed their lives to protect (there were always Trumps, hucksters out for whatever was there to be got, ego maniacs high on their own publicity), but most of us still believe our system beats theirs. The vast majority of Muslims agree, that’s why they’re fleeing ISIS territory in their millions.
@DrDaveT:
That’s always been the case. The only thing that is unique about this is that this latest wave of the dumb bigot movement is being led by an internet troll. (Trump has mastered social media; just sound like a junior high school punk bigot, and you’ll have an audience.)
@Mikey:
He’s contradicting his own campaign manager.
I’m grateful to see that so many on the GOP side are denouncing this. When I first heard it and saw all the poll numbers about his supporters, I began wondering if I should start building a ‘hiding place’ upstairs for my Muslim neighbors.
I agree with whoever said that the people we really ought to be worried about, and watching, are Trump supporters. There was a pig’s head was left outside a mosque in Philly (not that far away for me) and it makes me really worry about the safety of Muslims I know.
@CSK: I’m not sure of the timeline–I inferred he was making a clarification in his interview with van Susteren. But I could be mistaken.
@Lynn Eggers:
My brain is too foggy this am to find the article or the tweet it referenced, but in response to his original comment about not allowing any muslims in he was asked on twitter if that meant muslim American citizens returning home. His campaign responded with something to the effect ‘he said everyone’. It seems to me that means everyone, but they might respond differently if your question was posed directly.
Edit: and I now see that SKI is much more clear headed this morning than I am.
@Gustopher: “Pinochet was a fascist, as well as Generalissimo Francisco Franco, and neither of them had the same virulent strain of xenophobia that led to the Nazis committing genocide”
No, they just rounded up and tortured and murdered anyone they considered a political “enemy>’
That’s so much better.
@WR:
Actually it is. It’s far from good, but it’s not the Holocaust.
It seems to me that few posters on Trump’s statement about Muslims are ready and willing to ask truly fundamental questions about Islam: Do American Muslims sigh up to all the necessary provisions of the Koran? Does the Koran require their adherents to perform jihad when called upon to do so? Would they? Do Muslims in America believe in the many jihad statements, around 127, in the Koran?
Do they believe in the ultimate triumph of Islam and a world Caliphate or not? Do they believe in the abrogated Suras? Do they believe in the remainder of the Koran? Do these posters realize that the Hadith states that Muslims living in foreign nations must remain loyal to Islam or be considered apostates and subject to being killed? Do American Muslims believe that they are permitted by the Koran to lie, cheat, steal, and even murder infidels without any Islamic penalty?
Further, the Hadith states that Muslims can adapt to the foreign nation’s laws and culture while being internally loyal to Islam, but they must be ready and willing to perform jihad when called upon to do so by Islamic leaders, or risk apostasy and death. Do American Muslims believe this too? Are American Muslims ultimately willing to subjugate or kill infidels here in the US, when their strength in numbers is sufficient? Do we recognize that Muslims adhere to a belief in Islam as both a religion, and a government, and a way of life? Is that true of American Muslims?
This supports the fact that you cannot examine most American Muslims, or any Muslim immigrant or visitor, and determine their true loyalty to the US, democracy, and freedom, as opposed to Islam. Their religion permits them to lie to infidels.
It also supports the idea that there is a risk of significant proportions in allowing numbers of Muslims to enter the US, either as visitors or as immigrants, and it raises suspicion that the current and growing Muslim population in the US poses a similar threat of ultimate jihad against infidels when the time is right later on according to foreign Islamic leaders–even 20 or 30 years from now. as their numbers grow.
A clear and definitive answer to these crucial questions, driven by the Koran, is missing in the meta dialogue about Islam and Muslims in the US today. I would be very grateful to anyone that can totally and factually refute these provisions of the Koran and the Hadith for Muslims in America. This is not a question of bigotry, but simply an honest question of whither Islam in America, and what to do with true answers, if anything.
@anjin-san:
And of course, our internment camps (excuse me, re-education camps, or even less correctly, Arbeit Mach Frei centers) will also include ALL followers of the Prophet who are are currently serving in the US Military, domestically and overseas. I’d call The Trumpster an idiot, but that would be an insult to all right (and left) thinking idiots everywhere.
@Sherparick:
and shoot, it’s even easier to go to Home Despot and buy fertilizer and stop off at the gas station for a couple of gallons of diesel. Just sayin’