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Rand Paul Still Bizarrely Obsessed With Bill Clinton And Sex

Last week, I noted that Kentucky Senator Rand Paul, who may or may not end up running for President in 2014, argued that President Bill Clinton’s sexual dalliances should somehow be relevant in a race against Hillary Clinton in 2016. This week, Paul is continuing in that vein, arguing in an interview to be aired tomorrow that Democrats should return all the money that the former President has raised for  them:

Sen. Rand Paul, who has been in a bit of a tiff recently with the Clintons, says that any Democrat who has raised campaign money with former President Clinton should return the cash to protest his sexual behavior in the White House.

Speaking on C-SPAN’s “Newsmakers” program, in an interview airing Sunday, Mr. Paul said Democrats are being hypocritical by criticizing Republicans as waging a war on women while at the same time embracing Mr. Clinton, who was impeached for lying about a sexual relationship with a White House intern.

“They can’t have it both ways. And so I really think that anybody who wants to take money from Bill Clinton or have a fundraiser has a lot of explaining to do. In fact, I think they should give the money back,” Mr. Paul, Kentucky Republican, said. “If they want to take position on women’s rights, by all means do. But you can’t do it and take it from a guy who was using his position of authority to take advantage of young women in the workplace.”

There can really only be one explanation for Senator Paul’s bizarre obsession with former President Clinton and events that took place nearly two decades ago. Primarily, it is quite obviously an effort on his part to appeal to the hard right base of the GOP, which is obviously quite ready to resume the Clinton Derangement Syndrome of the 90s once the time comes that Obama Derangement Syndrome becomes passe. The idea that this has anything to do with the “War On Women” only makes sense if you view it through that lens. In the end, while it may help Paul appeal to the hard right there’s simply no way that stuff like this is going to improve the GOP position with women.

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About Doug Mataconis
Doug holds a B.A. in Political Science from Rutgers University and J.D. from George Mason University School of Law. He joined the staff of OTB in May, 2010 and also writes at Below The Beltway. Follow Doug on Twitter | Facebook

Comments

  1. LAgraves says:

    Someone said this is because Mr. Clinton is doing a fund-raiser for Grimes, who is running against McConnell. Supposedly Rand and McConnell are friends, now.

    Like or Dislike: Thumb up 9 Thumb down 0

  2. C. Clavin says:

    This is pretty simple, really.
    When your ideas are stupid…and have been proven to be failures…as have all the Republican and Libertarian ideas…then all you have left to sell is fear and hate.

    Highly-rated. Helpful or Unhelpful: Thumb up 28 Thumb down 7

  3. MBunge says:

    Let’s not overlook the obvious. Maybe Paul is honestly disgusted by Bill’s behavior and is too socially awkward to realize how weird it is to be going on about it this many years later. This is the guy who went on cable tv and he didn’t support civil rights laws.

    Mike

    Like or Dislike: Thumb up 15 Thumb down 2

  4. Smooth Jazz says:

    “There can really only be one explanation for Senator Paul’s bizarre obsession with former President Clinton and events that took place nearly two decades ago.”

    Say What??? So you are suggesting what Clinton did was OK because it happened 20 years ago? Give me a break. As Paul said, Clinton was (and may still be) a serial predator who preyed on young women who worked for him. Whether that should affect how people view his wife if she runs for President is another matter; But you cannot with a straight face blog that this behavior was OK or should be excused.

    That said, I’m not that surprised far left blogs like Outside the Beltway would excuse this disturbing behavior just because it was perpetrated by a LIberal. Your scorn for Repub women such as Gov Palin tells us you are OK with predatory behavior form a former President just because you agree with his beliefs. Not to mention your excusing and justifying Obama and the ObamaCare fraud he perpetrated on the country – A fraud that will likely disrupt the lives of tens of millions of Americans before the country says enough is enough.

    Regardless of his motivation or whether it is “politically correct” in the eyes of far left blogs and the Wash DC/NY Liberal dominated echo chamber: Sen Paul is correct in saying Clinton is and was a sexual predator.

    Poorly-rated. Helpful or Unhelpful: Thumb up 6 Thumb down 55

  5. LAgraves says:

    @Smooth Jazz: Why do people like you come here and spew lies? This blog is FAR FROM being leftist, and is actually a very fair and balanced blog with lots of interesting ideas and facts. BTW, I hope you know that posting your right-wing talking points here is not going to change anyone’s mind.

    Highly-rated. Helpful or Unhelpful: Thumb up 23 Thumb down 4

  6. C. Clavin says:

    @Smooth Jazz:
    What a terrific recitation of Fox News Talking Points.
    Thanks.

    Highly-rated. Helpful or Unhelpful: Thumb up 21 Thumb down 5

  7. john personna says:

    @Smooth Jazz:

    An affair with a 22 year old woman may be bad, but a consensual affair, exchange of gifts, etc., is hardly “predation.”

    Who doesn’t know men and women, here?

    (See also, France)

    Highly-rated. Helpful or Unhelpful: Thumb up 25 Thumb down 4

  8. humanoid.panda says:

    @C. Clavin: Imagine someone reading that monologue with some drumming in the background

    Like or Dislike: Thumb up 0 Thumb down 2

  9. James Pearce says:

    There can really only be one explanation for Senator Paul’s bizarre obsession

    Just one?

    It may be an appeal to the hard right, but I think it’s more of an indication of Paul’s willingness to embrace bad arguments. Anyone who listened to him explain some of his political positions knows he’s susceptible to hokum. Either he believes the hokum genuinely, in which case he’s a fool, or he wants you to believe it, in which case you’re the fool.

    And that’s the essential problem with Paul; there’s always a fool involved.

    Highly-rated. Helpful or Unhelpful: Thumb up 27 Thumb down 2

  10. Tyrell says:

    @C. Clavin: Rand needs to calm down, lay back, and smoke a good cigar.

    Like or Dislike: Thumb up 5 Thumb down 2

  11. john personna says:

    You know, while “kids will be kids” the campaign that put Levi Johnston on the national convention stage might actually have the weaker morals here.

    Poster boy, at one point.

    Like or Dislike: Thumb up 14 Thumb down 2

  12. CSK says:

    This may have been an extremely awkward attempt to cater to the hard right. Paul is currently in very bad odor with them for saying that the Republican Party should be more inclusive and for supporting Mitch McConnell, whom they regard as the ideological soul brother of Harry Reid. Yes, I know that’s idiotic, but that’s what the hard right believes.

    Like or Dislike: Thumb up 5 Thumb down 0

  13. al-Ameda says:

    @Smooth Jazz:

    Your scorn for Repub women such as Gov Palin tells us you are OK with predatory behavior form a former President just because you agree with his beliefs.

    So, explain again why this should be used against Hillary Clinton?

    Like or Dislike: Thumb up 16 Thumb down 3

  14. PJ says:

    @Smooth Jazz:

    ..far left blogs like Outside the Beltway…

    You’re funny.
    I laugh.
    Ha ha ha.

    Like or Dislike: Thumb up 10 Thumb down 3

  15. wr says:

    @Smooth Jazz: ” As Paul said, Clinton was (and may still be) a serial predator who preyed on young women who worked for him.”

    Oh, look, another Republican with no concept of what “consent” means. To Smoovie, like Paul, women are like children and must be controlled by men. The notion that a woman in her 20s had the agency to choose whether or not to have sex with one of the most powerful and charismatic men on the planet is completely foreign to him — of course Clinton is the predator — read: rapist — who took away her honor.

    This is the same reasoning that leads to saying that women who want an abortion must have metal wands thrust into their bodies so they can be forced to look at an ultrasound, or that if they’re allowed birth control they become sluts.

    And Republicans like Smoovie have no idea why they are accused of waging a war on women — because all they want to do is protect the fragile little flowers from the men who rightly run the world.

    Good luck with that rebranding, Smoovie!

    Highly-rated. Helpful or Unhelpful: Thumb up 27 Thumb down 3

  16. john personna says:

    @wr:

    I think that to the modern religious right, women are helpless things who, if they can’t hold an aspirin between their knees, just need to raise the child in the church and party.

    You are only a “slut” if you don’t take that path. It’s sex without procreation that is sluttish.

    Thus Bristol Palin is a role model, and Sandra Fluke is a slut.

    To bend your irony meter to 11 though …

    Sarah Palin defends Rush Limbaugh, cites ‘hypocrisy’

    Highly-rated. Helpful or Unhelpful: Thumb up 23 Thumb down 2

  17. anjin-san says:

    Even more strange when you consider that sex between an older white man in a position of authority and a young, attractive woman seems to be one of the only types of sexual activity that modern “conservatives” deem to be acceptable…

    Like or Dislike: Thumb up 14 Thumb down 2

  18. Mr. Prosser says:

    I think Zandar got this right yesterday (Friday) http://zandarvts.blogspot.com/2014/02/last-call-for-rand-and-mitch-shuffle.html

    Like or Dislike: Thumb up 1 Thumb down 1

  19. michael reynolds says:

    Rand Paul is a screwed up human being. There’s something wrong with that boy. Setting aside his increasingly ludicrous adherence to the discredited and anachronistic ideology of libertarianism, there’s just something not right there. You can see it in his eyes, hear it in his voice. There’s some crazy there.

    My guess is we’re just about a year away from learning about his African-American dominatrix mistress. That is the usual GOP pattern: attack other people’s morals while you’re banging your secretary and divorcing your sick wife.

    Highly-rated. Helpful or Unhelpful: Thumb up 26 Thumb down 4

  20. Andre Kenji says:

    Well, I have problems with the way that Bill Clinton dealt with Monica Lewinsky, that was sexual harassment at it´s worst. But most of the damage that Monica Lewinsky suffered was due to the coverage from the media and to the Republicans. Very few Republicans worried at the time about Monica, about her reputation or her personal life(She now lives in London, with no husband nor long term relationship, and with not stable job).

    Besides that, that was like 16, 17 years ago. Had Bill impregnated her, their love child would be almost an adult, maybe serving in the Army or going to the college. Life goes on.

    Like or Dislike: Thumb up 5 Thumb down 6

  21. Smooth Jazz says:

    @LAgraves:

    “@Smooth Jazz: Why do people like you come here and spew lies? This blog is FAR FROM being leftist, and is actually a very fair and balanced blog with lots of interesting ideas and facts”

    To be sure, James Joyner’s blogs were arguably right of center, if not overtly conservative, up until the 2008 election from what I could tell. I remember because this becuase I was a regular visitor and commenter on Dr Joyner’s platforms up until that time. Then something happened during the 2008 election, Lefttist posters such as Doug M & Steven T moved the blogs left and the visitors and commenters on the portal because overwhelmingly Liberal. Apparently, a community organizer who barely spent time in the IL House & the US Senate and who never ran anything in his life was the motivation for a leftward drift of this blog. We now know this community organizer had no clue what he was doing and is clearly in over his head a President.

    Even more disturbing to me was the attacks on Gov Palin, a former City & State executive, with way more management experience at the time than the empty suit Obama. Egged on by the Wash DC/NY left wing dominated media and echo chamber, the attacks on Gov Palin by the posters such as Doug M were visceral and personal – and that told me all I needed to know that this blog had cast his lot with the left wing, even if the posters here were not as far left as the cranks that post at Daily Kos, Dem Underground, TBogg, etc. In hindsight, we now know that Obama was in over his head, was only good at giving speeches, and whose ObamaCare boondoggle will go down in history as perhaps the biggest Gov’t fraud ever perpetrated on the American people. Obama should be glad he wasn’t working in the private sector, as the scam he perpertrated would have likely earned him a cell next to Madoff. Gov Palin may not have read the newspapers that left wing cocktail party types that Katie Couric subscribed to, but her and McCain almost surely would have done a better job that Obama the buffoon.

    Back to your claim that this is FAR FROM being leftist, consider this: There are 20 comments to this posting as I write this, and 19 are from Liberals – with 4 or 5 attacking me – The only right of center commenter on this post so far. 19 comments from Liberals versus 1 from me who just came here to jerk the chains of a bunch of left wing cranks who I knew would attack me just for commenting. WHEN ALMOST ALL THE COMMENTERS ON A BLOG ARE LIBERAL, IF IT WALKS & TALKS LIKE A DUCK, IT IS A DUCK.

    Poorly-rated. Helpful or Unhelpful: Thumb up 5 Thumb down 22

  22. ernieyball says:

    …who I knew would attack me just for commenting.

    “…bash in my brain and make me scream with pain…”
    Masochism Tango anyone?
    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=SpFsRSMq09w

    Like or Dislike: Thumb up 3 Thumb down 1

  23. michael reynolds says:

    @Smooth Jazz:

    You misunderstand.

    Let’s start with this: James is a smart guy. Agreed?

    The GOP has grown progressively dumber. Dumb, dumber, dumbest, and eventually, you.

    But James did not suffer a stroke, early onset Alzheimers, or any other condition that would significantly reduce his IQ. So the party that used to fit him, now only fits people like you.

    Now do you understand?

    Highly-rated. Helpful or Unhelpful: Thumb up 34 Thumb down 4

  24. al-Ameda says:

    @Smooth Jazz:

    Lefttist posters such as Doug M & Steven T moved the blogs left and the visitors and commenters on the portal because overwhelmingly Liberal.

    There is no evidence to back that assertion at all.

    Like or Dislike: Thumb up 13 Thumb down 3

  25. ernieyball says:

    …attacks on Gov Palin, a former City & State executive…

    AKA Princess 1/2 Term.

    Like or Dislike: Thumb up 14 Thumb down 2

  26. MBunge says:

    “An affair with a 22 year old woman may be bad, but a consensual affair, exchange of gifts, etc., is hardly “predation.””

    Yeah, I doubt too many women (especially self-described feminists) would call what Bill had with Monica “an affair”. “Predation” is probably too strong but it was much closer to exploitation than a relationship of equals.

    Mike

    Like or Dislike: Thumb up 7 Thumb down 3

  27. ernieyball says:

    …relationship of equals.

    This is a myth just like the “Free Love” in the 60′s!
    HA! Even then there was always a price to pay!

    Like or Dislike: Thumb up 4 Thumb down 0

  28. anjin-san says:

    WHEN ALMOST ALL THE COMMENTERS ON A BLOG ARE LIBERAL RATIONAL…

    FTFY

    Like or Dislike: Thumb up 8 Thumb down 3

  29. LAgraves says:

    @Smooth Jazz: I cannot believe that you think Obamacare is a huge fraud! It is modeled after Romneycare, which the Heritage people first formulated. Now granted, there are kinks that need to be worked out re:Obamacare, but as my GOP/Father/who sat on hospital board for 20 years says, Obamacare is a good first start.

    Like or Dislike: Thumb up 10 Thumb down 3

  30. anjin-san says:

    @ Smooth Jazz

    we now know that Obama was in over his head

    Let me ask you something – do you own real estate? Have an investment portfolio – 401K, IRA, stocks, mutual funds?

    If the answer is yes, are you doing better today, or the day before Obama took office?

    If the answer is no, that probably gives us some insight into why you think Palin is the answer to anything.

    Like or Dislike: Thumb up 12 Thumb down 4

  31. rudderpedals says:

    Jazzy, the net’s lousy with heavily curated self-reinforcing comment thread management. You don’t really want another one. OTB’s a tough room. That ISTM’s a feature, not a bug.

    Like or Dislike: Thumb up 8 Thumb down 3

  32. ernieyball says:

    Maybe Dandy Rand Paul should return the $30,000 he received from Alliance Coal since they have been raping the Earth.

    http://maplight.org/us-congress/legislator/1497-rand-paul

    Like or Dislike: Thumb up 1 Thumb down 2

  33. Kari Q says:

    I don’t know that I quite agree with any of the ways the Lewinsky-Clinton relationship is being described here. From all I’ve heard (and I admit I followed it as little as possible at the time) Lewinsky was a more than willing participant. Clinton should have known better, and the fact that he didn’t tell her “Go away, little girl” says nothing good about him. But I don’t know that I would call it harassment or exploitation.

    I have always felt for her. Lots of girls make stupid mistakes about relationships at that age; most of us get to bury them in our past and talk about them later only if we choose to. Monica will always be known as the girl who … with Bill Clinton in the Oval Office. I wonder how often she wishes she’d never even visited Washington.

    Highly-rated. Helpful or Unhelpful: Thumb up 29 Thumb down 2

  34. anjin-san says:

    Paul should probably pressure his dad to give back the money he made running a racist newsletter.

    Like or Dislike: Thumb up 12 Thumb down 3

  35. Mr. Replica says:

    The only thing more ridiculous than Rand Paul’s obsession with Pres. Big Willy’s willy, is Sen. Paul’s new campaign commercial.

    Have you seen it?

    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=7FnAV1XbfKE

    Like or Dislike: Thumb up 1 Thumb down 1

  36. Smooth Jazz says:

    @michael reynolds:

    “@Smooth Jazz: You misunderstand.”Let’s start with this: James is a smart guy. Agreed?
    The GOP has grown progressively dumber. Dumb, dumber, dumbest, and eventually, you.
    But James did not suffer a stroke, early onset Alzheimers, or any other condition that would significantly reduce his IQ. So the party that used to fit him, now only fits people like you.
    Now do you understand?”

    Aahhh, After being told over and over and over, this isn’t a left wing blog, finally some honesty: Acknowledgement that Dr Joyner no longer believes the GOP fits him and he has thrown in his lot with the Liberals. That’s Ok. Some people who’ve switched to the Repub party in recent years thinks the same way about the Dem party. These things cut both ways. It’s refreshing to see someone here finally acknowledged what is obvious to anyone who can read: The “tenor” of the stories on this blog support the left wing view and the posters here more often that not hive up left wing talking points.

    All that said, the obvious tipoff is this: Out of 34 comments on this thread as of this writing, everyone except one (me) is from a Liberal. At least Michael Reynolds is willing to acknowledge the obvious: This place is like any other left wing blog where everybody sings kumbaya in the same echo chamber and repeat the same talking points amongst themselves. Where ObamaCare “signups” is touted as a success whether it is medicaid free riders, whether these “signups” have paid or not, or whether they are simply “churn” from the millions who had their insurance cancelled, etc – when all the evidence suggests that they even the vast majority of the previously uninsured don’t want any part of this ObamaCare scam where premiums, deductibles and co-pays are through the roof, even with Gov’t subsidies. Yeah, keep celebrating all your “singups” and sing kumbaya to the other Liberals around here that all is well with this disastrous boondoggle.

    Too bad 2014 is looking a lot like 2010 when Dems were obliterated losing 60+ House seats and 6 Senate seats. Can’t wait to stop by here and see Doug M and company try to spin the results to try make the LIberals look good and all the left wings cranks who post here try to justify the upcoming train wreck. “You can keep your plan”. “You can keep your dcotor”. Lies of the century by a community organizing buffoon masquerading as President. LOL.

    Hot debate. What do you think? Thumb up 3 Thumb down 17

  37. al-Ameda says:

    @Smooth Jazz:

    Too bad 2014 is looking a lot like 2010 when Dems were obliterated losing 60+ House seats and 6 Senate seats.

    Yes, I’m sure that the GOP will pick up 60+ seats in the House.

    Like or Dislike: Thumb up 9 Thumb down 2

  38. michael reynolds says:

    @Smooth Jazz:

    Some people who’ve switched to the Repub party in recent years thinks the same way about the Dem party. These things cut both ways.

    Except that they don’t. The GOP is losing membership and credibility, and even the dumbest Republicans by now have noticed that they are in a demographic cul-de-sac. Can’t attract blacks or hispanics, can’t attract the young or the educated, can’t attract anyone really but aging rustic white folks. Every growing demographic is lost to you.

    Your economic ideas are dead, your social issues are dead, you are without leadership, you are divided between crazy and crazier still, hacking away at each other with endless purges-in-the-making. Yeah, some clever gerrymandering will keep you alive in 2014, but you’re the Wehrmacht after D-Day. You’ll get your Battle of the Bulge, and then with sheer numbers we will crush you.

    Highly-rated. Helpful or Unhelpful: Thumb up 20 Thumb down 2

  39. ernieyball says:
  40. Mr. Replica says:

    @ernieyball:

    Nice nipple. Is it yours?

    Like or Dislike: Thumb up 0 Thumb down 0

  41. rudderpedals says:

    @ernieyball: Cool but NSFW outside of Nevada.

    Like or Dislike: Thumb up 0 Thumb down 0

  42. Mr. Replica says:

    @michael reynolds:

    Doug even went over this a month ago with this entry:

    http://www.outsidethebeltway.com/self-identified-independents-hit-record-high-self-identified-republicans-hit-record-low/

    Seeing as the poll was NOT “unskewed”… it’s completely understandable why other posters here at OtB wouldn’t take it seriously.

    Like or Dislike: Thumb up 1 Thumb down 0

  43. Smooth Jazz says:

    @michael reynolds:

    “Except that they don’t. The GOP is losing membership and credibility, and even the dumbest Republicans by now have noticed that they are in a demographic cul-de-sac. Can’t attract blacks or hispanics, can’t attract the young or the educated, can’t attract anyone really but aging rustic white folks. Every growing demographic is lost to you.”

    Yeah, That explains why the GOP is ahead of nearly every generic vote for the 2014 Mid terms and why the Dems are looking at a major spanking in Nov. When a Rep is leading the Senate race in reliably Blue MI, you know the Libs are going to get spanked this fal. Heck the way things are going as a result of the ObamaCare catastrophe MI, OR, IA, MN, CO & NH Sen races may fall the GOP’s way this year to join all the other Sen races where the GOP will almost surely win. The GOP may be losing membership but the Dems are going to lose the 2014 elections BIG TIME. You can continue to live in denial and hold hands with the other LIberal cranks that hang out here and believe all is well with the Dems.

    Like or Dislike: Thumb up 3 Thumb down 11

  44. michael reynolds says:

    @Smooth Jazz:

    Well, I guess we’ll see, won’t we? Your Congress has the lowest approval in history, your party ID is at its lowest ever, and your voter base is aging out. But you people never could do basic math. Your most recent presidential candidate is still riding his car elevator up and down and crying, “Did I win, Mommy? Am I president yet?”

    Like or Dislike: Thumb up 16 Thumb down 3

  45. ernieyball says:

    @Mr. Replica: In my dreams! Apparently it belongs to Jesus now!
    I was once married to a Roman Catholic gal. Unfortunately she celebrated the Communion Wine from about 11:00 am till midnight every day.
    Don’t know if I could pass the ice cold baptism test. You know…shrinkage.
    ——-
    NSFW? Oh, sorry. Since I retired I lost track of Internet Etiquette…

    Like or Dislike: Thumb up 2 Thumb down 0

  46. PJ says:

    @Smooth Jazz:

    Yeah, That explains why the GOP is ahead of nearly every generic vote for the 2014 Mid terms and why the Dems are looking at a major spanking in Nov. When a Rep is leading the Senate race in reliably Blue MI, you know the Libs are going to get spanked this fal. Heck the way things are going as a result of the ObamaCare catastrophe MI, OR, IA, MN, CO & NH Sen races may fall the GOP’s way this year to join all the other Sen races where the GOP will almost surely win. The GOP may be losing membership but the Dems are going to lose the 2014 elections BIG TIME. You can continue to live in denial and hold hands with the other LIberal cranks that hang out here and believe all is well with the Dems.

    Smooth Jazz certainly is the master of election predictions.
    What was it that you predicted in 2012?

    Then the election happened and you crawled back under your rock.

    And now you’re back. Do you actually think people have forgotten your predictions? Just because you tend to spend November smashing your head against the wall doesn’t mean that the rest of us are.

    F*ck, you’re stupid.

    Like or Dislike: Thumb up 14 Thumb down 2

  47. Mr. Replica says:

    @ernieyball:

    Jesus gets all the chicks.

    …stupid Jesus.

    Like or Dislike: Thumb up 3 Thumb down 0

  48. ernieyball says:

    @Mr. Replica: Jesus gets all the chicks.

    Because…
    Jesus was a Capricorn he ate organic food…

    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=yCdfYkUPvTs

    Like or Dislike: Thumb up 3 Thumb down 0

  49. PJ says:

    @Smooth Jazz:

    Yeah, That explains why the GOP is ahead of nearly every generic vote for the 2014 Mid terms and why the Dems are looking at a major spanking in Nov.

    While we are at it, show me a poll where the GOP is ahead. I’m not saying that the Dems are ahead. I’m saying that you probably should read up on the margin of error. There’s currently no generic poll for the Congress where either the GOP or the Dems has a lead that’s outside the margin of error.

    Like or Dislike: Thumb up 4 Thumb down 2

  50. Mr. Replica says:

    @ernieyball:

    I have to admit, that was the first time I’ve (knowingly) heard Kris Kristofferson sing. And, uh, that was a special kind of horrible.

    Thanks.

    Like or Dislike: Thumb up 0 Thumb down 0

  51. MBunge says:

    “But I don’t know that I would call it harassment or exploitation.”

    Ugh. I hate to revisit this but there’s a lot of myth-making that’s gone on over this and that’s usually not all that healthy.

    She was a young 20something intern. He was old enough to be her father, her superior in the office and the most powerful man in the world. The power imbalance there is almost impossible to over-emphasize. And, to be somewhat delicate, the sexual relationship between them was not exactly reciprocal.

    This was not Bill boinking some 35 year old environmental lobbyist. He didn’t have an “understanding” with Hillary. And when caught, he didn’t tell the truth or tell us it was none of our business. And when he lied and covered up, he didn’t do it for the country or his family. He did it entirely for himself.

    I think it’s important to remember this stuff because a lot of conservative lunacy was supercharged in that era and it’s not helpful to pretend that happened out of nowhere with no provocation at all.

    Mike

    Like or Dislike: Thumb up 11 Thumb down 3

  52. grumpy realist says:

    @Smooth Jazz: Dude–just because you get pounded upon in the comments doesn’t mean that it’s a bunch of far leftists ganging up on someone on the right.

    It might be also that you have just said something mindboggingly stupid.

    Ever consider that?

    Like or Dislike: Thumb up 16 Thumb down 3

  53. ernieyball says:

    @Mr. Replica: That was years ago. When he was a hit!
    There are more recent recordings but…Anyway I always thought the song was a toot!

    On the other hand there is Joe Cocker!

    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_wG6Cgmgn5U

    Like or Dislike: Thumb up 1 Thumb down 0

  54. rudderpedals says:

    @ernieyball: No harm no foul. The beautiful image far exceeds my workplace’s third world brothel style acceptable use policies.

    Like or Dislike: Thumb up 0 Thumb down 0

  55. anjin-san says:

    @ Smooth

    Here’s the latest attempt on my part to get you to listen to real jazz

    More real jazz

    Like or Dislike: Thumb up 2 Thumb down 2

  56. Mr. Replica says:

    @ernieyball: @ernieyball:

    Good ol’ Joe.

    As great as he is, he always makes me think of John Belushi.

    Like or Dislike: Thumb up 1 Thumb down 0

  57. ernieyball says:

    @rudderpedals: …workplace…

    Not sure what constitutes your workplace.
    I often forget that my 35 year career working outside on telephone lines is just not the same as working indoors. Factory, office, retail…whatever.
    While there were some drawbacks, two of the longest winters I ever spent outside were in the vicinity of Fond du Lac, Wisconsin, I was almost always on my own and didn’t have to worry much about co-workers sensitivities or office policies or politics.
    In the future I will try to be mindful that these posts can be seen by all.

    Like or Dislike: Thumb up 1 Thumb down 0

  58. ernieyball says:

    @Mr. Replica: Yeah, Belushi was great act! Too bad he couldn’t stay alive.

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  59. PJ says:

    @ernieyball:

    Yeah, Belushi was great act! Too bad he couldn’t stay alive.

    Jim Belushi is still alive though! ;)

    Dan Harmon: Wait, do you do a Jim Belushi impression?
    Mitch Hurwitz: Well, I do a bad John Belushi, so yes.

    Like or Dislike: Thumb up 3 Thumb down 0

  60. Motopilot says:

    @anjin-san:

    Here’s the latest attempt on my part to get you to listen to real jazz

    Thanks for that, man. Never understood this “smooth jazz” genre. (Soft pop music played with a saxophone isn’t jazz.)

    Like or Dislike: Thumb up 2 Thumb down 2

  61. gVOR08 says:

    @Smooth Jazz:

    Dr Joyner no longer believes the GOP fits him and he has thrown in his lot with the Liberals.

    By saying he leans toward Jeb Bush. And FTFY (fixed this for you):

    Out of 34 comments on this thread as of this writing, everyone except one (me) is from a Liberal is to the left of me.

    You’re welcome.

    Like or Dislike: Thumb up 6 Thumb down 1

  62. wr says:

    @MBunge: Welcome to the human race. Young pretty female has sex with older powerful male. If this is something that disturbs you so greatly you still can’t accept it 20 years after the fact, all I can say is you should never never never never read any history.

    Like or Dislike: Thumb up 11 Thumb down 1

  63. PJ says:

    @Smooth Jazz:

    Back to your claim that this is FAR FROM being leftist, consider this: There are 20 comments to this posting as I write this, and 19 are from Liberals – with 4 or 5 attacking me – The only right of center commenter on this post so far. 19 comments from Liberals versus 1 from me who just came here to jerk the chains of a bunch of left wing cranks who I knew would attack me just for commenting. WHEN ALMOST ALL THE COMMENTERS ON A BLOG ARE LIBERAL, IF IT WALKS & TALKS LIKE A DUCK, IT IS A DUCK.

    That all the blogs you normally read and comment on bans those with opposing views doesn’t mean that OTB does it too. Try to get that into your head.

    Like or Dislike: Thumb up 5 Thumb down 2

  64. al-Ameda says:
  65. Kari Q says:

    @MBunge:

    She was a young 20something intern. He was old enough to be her father, her superior in the office and the most powerful man in the world. The power imbalance there is almost impossible to over-emphasize. And, to be somewhat delicate, the sexual relationship between them was not exactly reciprocal.

    But to say that the power imbalance means that she was exploited and harassed is to take away all agency from Ms. Lewinsky, make her nothing more than a passive victim of a predatory older man. Now, if you can point to statements that she made that shows that is how she viewed the relationship, I’ll retract what I said. That is not my memory of her attitude, at all. She wanted to be sexually involved with him. She pursued the relationship. She made decisions – horribly bad and often wrong decisions, but they were hers.

    All the things you say are reasons why he should have known better, why he should have told her no. But they aren’t proof that she was his victim.

    Like or Dislike: Thumb up 8 Thumb down 2

  66. anjin-san says:

    @ al-Ameda

    Coletrane’s work on ballads was beyond sublime. Don’t think anyone ever did Eckstine better.

    This is one of my favorites. Sure wish he had done a few more ballad albums.

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  67. al-Ameda says:

    @anjin-san:

    Sure wish he had done a few more ballad albums.

    Thanks for posting that, it’s a personal favorite. Also on that album is Lonnie’s Lament – a really really blue piece, after a beautiful intro, Coltrane hands off to Tyner for some really nice playing. To me, ‘Crescent’ and ‘A Love Supreme’ are book ends, one leads naturally to the other, both are very spiritual.

    I always have time for the music of John Coltrane.

    Like or Dislike: Thumb up 1 Thumb down 0

  68. Smooth Jazz says:

    @al-Ameda: @al-Ameda:

    “Not exactly smooth jazz, but some of the most powerful and beautiful tenor saxophone playing Â… ever.”

    Trane’s “I want to Talk to You”. Wow, That is a classic that belongs to the ages along with Mr Coltrane. I have not heard that classic in years. Thanks for sharing that. I have saved it in my favorities. Though I’m more into the contemprary saxophonist such as Najee, Gerald Albright, Nelson Rangell, Boney James & Everett Harp, I very much appreciate the music of some of the sax giants of yesteryear including Lester Young, Coleman Hawkins, Sonny Rollins and of course John Coltrane. Losing Trane at such a young age was a major loss to the classic jazz genre and music in general.

    Like or Dislike: Thumb up 5 Thumb down 0

  69. Kylopod says:

    @Smooth Jazz: If OTB is a “far left blog,” please tell me some examples of blogs you would categorize as “center-left,” “center-right,” and “far right.” Furthermore, please list some specific “far-left” positions that the bloggers at OTB have taken. I’m just curious.

    Like or Dislike: Thumb up 4 Thumb down 1

  70. anjin-san says:

    Did someone say contemporary saxophonist?

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  71. Matt Bernius says:

    @Kari Q and @MBunge both raise some good points. And the application of loaded terms like “predator” or “victim” to this incident doesn’t do much good.

    That said, I think there’s a particular part of Kari’s comment that’s worth revisiting:

    All the things you say are reasons why he should have known better, why he should have told her no. But they aren’t proof that she was his victim.

    [Emphasis mine.]

    Was what happened or the fall out impeachment worthy? No.

    But those who just brush this incident off or excuse his behavior with a “men have done this since the beginning of time” are taking a problematic position. There were countless red flags about this situation — beyond the various power dynamic issues, it’s worth considering how being placed in a compromising position could (and arguably did) undermine Clinton’s ability to govern effectively.

    Like or Dislike: Thumb up 6 Thumb down 1

  72. Matt Bernius says:

    @Smooth Jazz:

    That explains why the GOP is ahead of nearly every generic vote for the 2014 Mid terms and why the Dems are looking at a major spanking in Nov.

    It should be remembered that “generic” is never on the ballot. And historically, “generic” candidates often do far better in early polling than the actual candidate (there were periods where “generic” republicans were beating Obama and other vulnerable Dems like Claire McCaskill… we know how both those cases turned out).

    Beyond that, as other’s have pointed out, your historic prognostication record in elections dating back as far as 2008 has been, shall we say, dismal (you did go on record predicting wins for McCain and Romney). You also attacked Nate Silver and our own Steven Taylor for not knowing what they were talking about when it came to polling.

    So why exactly should we take any thing you predict seriously?

    Like or Dislike: Thumb up 11 Thumb down 1

  73. anjin-san says:

    A forgotten gem from Ike Quebec

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  74. ernieyball says:

    @anjin-san: Must be Mr. Whistle Dick doing the down voting on these posts. I heard he’s short on brains and has a tin ear.

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  75. gVOR08 says:

    Rand Paul Still Bizarrely Obsessed With Bill Clinton And Sex

    Could just as well have read, “Conservatives Still Bizarrely Obsessed With Other People’s Sex”

    Like or Dislike: Thumb up 3 Thumb down 0

  76. Neil Hudelson says:

    @al-Ameda: @anjin-san:

    I would never describe it as “beautiful” (at least in the aesthetic sense), but Coltrane’s “Africa” certainly is the most powerful piece I’ve ever heard.

    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=plafqYAw2FA

    Like or Dislike: Thumb up 2 Thumb down 0

  77. al-Ameda says:

    @Neil Hudelson:
    I remember when, as a 16 year old know-nothing-about-jazz, I went into a local record shop, and based on the album cover alone, I purchased John Coltrane’s “Impressions.” I went home I dropped the needle on “India” and that was it – I had no idea what I was in for, it changed the way I thought about, and listened to, music forever.

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