Saturday’s Forum

FILED UNDER: Open Forum
James Joyner
About James Joyner
James Joyner is Professor and Department Head of Security Studies at Marine Corps University's Command and Staff College and a nonresident senior fellow at the Scowcroft Center for Strategy and Security at the Atlantic Council. He's a former Army officer and Desert Storm vet. Views expressed here are his own. Follow James on Twitter @DrJJoyner.

Comments

  1. Teve says:

    A friend posted a Trump fundraising email:

    Friend,

    While Georgia is recounting all of their ballots BY HAND, they mysteriously found THOUSANDS of MISSING ballots. That’s THOUSANDS of Georgians who almost didn’t have a vote this Election.

    This is unacceptable. The American People deserve better than this.

    President Trump is working around the clock to DEFEND the Election from the Radical Left, but he can’t do it without you, Friend. If we don’t FIGHT BACK with everything we’ve got, America as we know it is gone.

    The Left will RAISE your taxes, PACK the Courts, and DESTROY the economy. We need YOUR HELP if we’re going to STOP THEM. This is our fight and the President needs you RIGHT NOW.

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  2. Teve says:

    “As with everything Donald Trump does, the intention is as malign as you can think, the execution is as incompetent as you can imagine”

    Fareed Zakaria

    linky

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  3. OzarkHillbilly says:

    After a string of sleepless nights and 2 days of up and down up and down up and down a ladder, I decided to take preventative measures to stave off the storm of charlie horses I knew was coming, and took a vicodin. I didn’t get the CHs (thank dawg) but I still had trouble falling asleep. When I eventually did fall asleep, holy shit, what nightmare/dream.

    I dreamt I was suffering from severe sleep deprivation. Nothing I did was right, kept forgetting simple little steps like putting a filter in the coffee machine basket. Everything I tried to do was just like that. Finally my wife had had enough and chased me out of the house where she thought I couldn’t do as much damage.

    That’s when things went south.

    I got in my truck to run a quick errand. I soon forgot what the errand was and ended up driving to N STL. There was this strap on top of my dashboard and it was bothering me, so I pulled on it. It came with some difficulty but in the process I pulled up the rug covering my driver side floorboard, which opened a hole into my engine compartment (I used to own a truck with just such a hole, driving thru puddles at speed was not a good idea) and out of the hole came a whole menagerie of animals, starting with about 17 possums (in the dream I lost count) a wolf, a hawk, a pheasant, and a couple more I no longer clearly remember. So I’m fighting my truck to the curb and trying to brake with a cab full of not very happy wild animals crawling all over me. I finally get stopped and spill out of the truck with all those critters and only one passerby even notices this very strange happening. I forget what he said.

    The dream went on, and on, and on, with me parking the truck and continuing on foot but soon I can’t remember where I left the truck. I know I can end the nightmare by simply calling my wife, but I really don’t want to because of how embarrassed I am about the whole situation. I suffer thru several more pratfalls, each more embarrassing than the last and still I resist calling her.

    Finally I give up and call her. My first words were, “Honey? I’m lost. Well, not really, I know where I am (I am looking up at a street sign) but I have no idea where the truck is.”

    And guess what? Yeah, that’s why I didn’t want to call her.

    I think I need some better drugs.

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  4. OzarkHillbilly says:

    A US judge has issued a blistering condemnation of industrial farming practices. The judgment comes as one US meat giant finally settles after a six-year legal battle with plaintiffs who sued the company over the stench, flies, buzzards and truck traffic coming from its industrial swine farms in North Carolina.

    J Harvie Wilkinson III, one of the judges in a case that pitted locals against the Smithfield subsidiary formerly known as Murphy-Brown, decried the “outrageous conditions” at Kinlaw Farms, the operation at the center of the lawsuit – “conditions that there is no reason to suppose were unique to that facility”.

    “How did it come to this?” wrote Wilkinson, who was nominated to the fourth US circuit court of appeals by then president Ronald Reagan and has served since 1984. “What was missing from Kinlaw Farms – and from Murphy-Brown – was the recognition that treating animals better will benefit humans. What was neglected is that animal welfare and human welfare, far from advancing at cross-purposes, are actually integrally connected. The decades-long transition to concentrated animal feeding operations [CAFOs] lays bare this connection, and the consequences of its breach, with startling clarity.”

    Wilkinson described a system in which pigs were forced to live in enclosures they had outgrown, reducing them “to almost suffocating closeness … The dangers endemic to such appalling conditions always manifested first in animal suffering. Ineluctably, however, the ripples of dysfunction would reach farm workers and, at last, members of the surrounding community.”

    His comments concurred with the court’s main opinion.

    When a Reagan appointed judge says you’ve gone too far, you’ve gone too far. And just in case you were wondering,

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  5. JohnMcC says:

    @OzarkHillbilly: To prevent nocturnal cramps, try antacids (Tums, etc). The cause of the cramp is lactic acid trapped in the vasculature of the muscle. Neutralizing the acid is what you want to do.

    Wonderful dream! Might be just what we’d have wanted 40 yrs ago. And pretty impressive your memory of it. Never remember my dreams. (I suspect I’m lucky that way.)

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  6. sam says:

    So much winning: Federal Judge Strikes DOJ from the Docket in E. Jean Carroll’s Case Against Donald Trump:

    Carroll says that Trump defamed her by denying that he raped her in the dressing room of the department store Bergdorf Goodman in the 1990s.

    The Justice Department tried to barge into the case in September, insisting that Trump responding to rape allegations with comments like “She’s not my type” is just one of the duties befitting of the President of the United States.

    Carroll’s legal described that proposition as wrong and obscene the next month.

    “There is not a single person in the United States — not the president and not anyone else — whose job description includes slandering women they sexually assaulted,” attorney Roberta Kaplan wrote last month in a blistering legal brief. “That should not be a controversial proposition. Remarkably, however, the Justice Department seeks to prove it wrong.”

    The Justice Department nevertheless persisted, only for Judge Kaplan to reject their effort mere days before the presidential election.

    “As explained above, the undisputed facts demonstrate that President Trump was not acting in furtherance of any duties owed to any arguable employer when he made the statements at issue,” the judge said. “His comments concerned an alleged sexual assault that took place several decades before he took office, and the allegations have no relationship to the official business of the United States. To conclude otherwise would require the Court to adopt a view that virtually everything the president does is within the public interest by virtue of his office. The government has provided no support for that theory, and the Court rejects it as too expansive.”

    The judge ordered on Friday that Trump’s prior private counsel in the state lawsuit represent the outgoing president in federal court.

    One of most salutary results of the election will be the departure of Bill Barr, Trump’s button man, from the DOJ. I despise him more than I do Trump.

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  7. Teve says:

    @JohnFugelsang

    Worth remembering that Giuliani said “Geoge Soros is the #1 donor to Antifa” yesterday & it didn’t even cause a ripple.

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  8. sam says:

    Judith Jarvis Thompson has passed away.

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  9. grumpy realist says:

    For those of you eagerly following the Three Stooges aspect of Trump’s “crack legal team”, here’s the next entrance in the saga…..

    It’s a howl.

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  10. Not the IT Dept. says:

    There’s a conversation of sorts in the “Kook” thread about whether or not Trump=Hitler. It’s a useless discussion – of course he’s not.

    But what makes it useless is that Americans tend to remember war-Hitler and not pre-war Hitler when he was remaking German society and getting them ready to accept a reality of violence in their daily lives, on the streets and against their neighbors who were Jews, foreigners, the “wrong” occupation or whatever. I believe it can be argued that Trump is willing to do his damnedest (and the word is totally accurate) to bring that anarchy about.

    What Hitler had that really made him “Hitler” was Goebbels. Goebbels had the work ethic that Hitler lacked and the understanding of communications that took Adolf’s personal obsessions and turned them into national threats. Hitler would not really have made that huge impact without Goebbels, and if you doubt me look at the fates of the Nazi leaders who didn’t have their own Goebbels. Never got anywhere and ended up dead.

    For me the question should be: did Bannon have it in him to be Goebbels? And is the only reason he didn’t make it is because Trump got jealous of all the attention he was getting as “Trump’s brain” and started freezing him out? Maybe this is one thing we can thank Jared and Ivanka for?

    In my high school we had to take a European History course, mostly 20th century. In reality most of it concentrated on how America won both world wars and how Americans could never do what those terrible Germans did. After all, someone was manning those concentration camps, someone was joining the street thugs and SA, Hitler didn’t do it all himself. Americans, we were told by our smug teachers, would NEVER do those kinds of things. (He made us watch “Judgement at Nuremberg” where Spencer Tracy tells off the Nazis for being terrible. And Judy Garland as a German frau who survived the camps; she’s surprisingly good.)

    Looking at the Proud Boys, the militias, the cops who seem not to understand what “serve and protect” means – can we really say that they’re not the tinder just waiting for a Goebbels to strike the spark?

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  11. steve says:

    Update on the Covid front at the micro level. Visited some of our more rural hospitals. Talked with our ICU staff. 3 interesting patients, all in the ICU. One who has Covid but is mad at his care team because Covid is a hoax and they cant figure out what is really wrong with him. Another pt with Covid who refuses treatments for Covid because he cant really have the fake disease. My favorite was actually the lol (little old lady) who believes that the IV meds being given her have chips in them so that the government can track her after she leaves the hospital. I really wanted to go talk with her but she desalts if she talks too much.

    Also, there were some claims that people on the right had stats showing the odds of being the voting results were a billion to one. Anyone seen where that came from? Boygenius, the math major, is home for the holidays. Would love to look at that with him.

    Steve

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  12. MarkedMan says:

    @steve:

    . One who has Covid but is mad at his care team because Covid is a hoax

    This actually makes sense to me. I imagine he spent the last several months railing to anyone who would listen that COVID is a hoax, telling family and friends in no u certain terms that they were stupid losers for buying into that lame-stream news. His alternative to denying that’s what he has is to admit he was the stupid loser. He may realize he has COVID but he so ULC to admit that out loud.

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  13. CSK says:
  14. gVOR08 says:

    @Not the IT Dept.: Isn’t Murdoch a closer parallel to Goebbels than Bannon?

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  15. James Joyner says:

    Just a note that I’m out of pocket this weekend sans laptop, so am unlikely to post any non-Open Forum content before Monday.

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  16. Northerner says:

    @sam:

    I’m definitely not a lawyer, so maybe I’m misinterpreting what the case is about — however my take away is that his claim of innocence is slander. But whether Trump sexually assaulted her or not (I’d guess he probably did), isn’t it a bit weird that claiming innocence is slander? For instance, if a cop arrests you for a crime in progress, and you claim you didn’t do it, is your claim of innocence slandering the cop?

    This sounds like something that’s going to be great for lawyers and rich people and companies who can afford high priced lawyers, not so good for poor people and small companies — ie its another avenue for SLAPP suits, like the ones big companies use against environmental activists or small companies wrt patents. Accuse someone of doing something, when they claim they didn’t go after them for slander.

    Suing someone like Trump for sexual assault seems to be a much better route.

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  17. DrDaveT says:

    @sam:

    One of most salutary results of the election will be the departure of Bill Barr, Trump’s button man, from the DOJ. I despise him more than I do Trump.

    Concur.

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  18. DrDaveT says:

    @Not the IT Dept.:

    Americans, we were told by our smug teachers, would NEVER do those kinds of things.

    Stanley Milgram proved otherwise in 1963. (I’d provide a link, but the quote/link/bold buttons are missing at the moment.) I always thought it was equally telling that the overwhelming reaction to his work was to decry it as an unethical experiment, rather than to worry about the findings.

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  19. MarkedMan says:

    @Northerner: Her claim makes sense to me. I assume the statute of limitations has passed so no criminal charges are possible. But it was recently that he called her a liar. If he assaulted her that’s proof he knew it was false when he did so, and that’s slander. Remember, what Trump is trying to stop is him having to submit a DNA sample. She kept the clothing she was wearing when he assaulted her and it has semen residue on it.

    Your cop analogy doesn’t apply, as the cop believes you are guilty. Slander has to be a deliberate lie.

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  20. charon says:

    @JohnMcC:

    To prevent nocturnal cramps, try antacids (Tums, etc). The cause of the cramp is lactic acid trapped in the vasculature of the muscle. Neutralizing the acid is what you want to do.

    Do Tums contain calcium? Calcium deficiency can cause cramps. I get fewer and milder CH now that I have an osteoporosis diagnosis and take calcium tablet supplements. Note also that sweating draws calcium out of the body, I up my dosage if summer weather (AZ) gets extra hot while I exercise.

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  21. Not the IT Dept. says:

    @gVOR08:

    No, Murdoch isn’t in a rise-and-fall relationship with Trump. Murdoch doesn’t slavishly worship Trump like Goebbels worshipped Hitler (even the other Nazis thought Goebbels was…odd…in that respect). Goebbels was an official party and administration right beside Hitler. And finally, Murdoch is and will continue to be a successful billionaire before, during and after Trump. No comparison.

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  22. charon says:

    @JohnMcC:

    The cause of the cramp is lactic acid trapped in the vasculature of the muscle. Neutralizing the acid is what you want to do.

    I do not see the logic here, the antacids affect stomach acid and do not affect blood pH. If antacids help, it’s more likely the calcium they contain.

    (Note other electrolyte imbalances can cause CH too, calcium is just a pretty likely one).

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  23. Michael Reynolds says:

    @steve:

    3 interesting patients, all in the ICU. One who has Covid but is mad at his care team because Covid is a hoax and they cant figure out what is really wrong with him. Another pt with Covid who refuses treatments for Covid because he cant really have the fake disease. My favorite was actually the lol (little old lady) who believes that the IV meds being given her have chips in them so that the government can track her after she leaves the hospital.

    Perfectly typical example of political partisanship, certainly not a cult of personality in which people are volunteering for death – indeed, actually dying by the thousands – rather than break faith with their cult leader.

    Ho hum, typical political sorting.

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  24. Northerner says:

    @MarkedMan:

    But if there’s no statute of limitations on civil suits, couldn’t she get the same affect by suing him rather than going after slander?

    The cop analogy isn’t about whether the cop thinks the person that’s guilty, its whether the accused knows they’re guilty while claiming innocence. That is, if I’m arrested but claim innocence, the cop could sue me on the grounds that I know I’m really guilty and so I’m slandering the cop by claiming not to have done anything (ie claiming innocence is calling the arresting cop a liar when I know I actually did something illegal).

    Whereas a civil suit for money is just about whether it happened or not, rather than about whether the accused believed it happened. That seems much easier for a poor person to defend against than slander based on whether or not they truly believe they’re innocent.

    Your mentioning the liar aspect is hopeful — ie maybe the lawsuit is based on his calling her a liar as opposed to just claiming innocence? That I can understand more — ie if I claim innocence then it might simply be that my accuser is mistaken, whereas if I say they’re a liar then I’m making a direct attack on their character?

    My non-lawyer concern is that someone with money and lawyers (especially companies with lawyers on regular payroll anyway) can say that the person claiming innocence is knowingly lying (ie they know they’re not innocent), and then take it to court, forcing the poorer party to spend resources they don’t have on lawyers (ie SLAPP) proving that they really believe they’re innocent.

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  25. Teve says:

    @CSK: I read some Lucianne today. It’s an established fact over there that nefarious Dems and the Deep State have fraudulently stolen the election. Oh and also cowardly RINOs like Ben Sasse.

    The right-wing in the US is dangerously crazy.

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  26. Teve says:

    Worldometer says COVID cases per capita, state rank, descending order:

    #1: North Dakota
    South Dakota
    Iowa
    Wisconsin
    Nebraska
    Utah
    Idaho
    Illinois
    Montana
    Tennessee
    Mississippi
    Alabama
    Arkansas
    Kansas
    Wyoming

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  27. sam says:

    @Northerner:

    Suing someone like Trump for sexual assault seems to be a much better route.

    Discovery is her friend.

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  28. CSK says:

    @Teve:
    Well, they’ve been claiming that all along. But even for Lucianne.com, I thought that thread was unusually over the top with the slobbering adulation of Trump.

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  29. Teve says:

    @SamWangPhD

    Here, two members of Congress, Richard Hudson and Paul Gosar, are willing to go on the record in favor of overriding election results to install Presidential electors.

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  30. charon says:

    @CSK:

    May God bless and keep safe President Trump, his family; Rush and Kathryn Limbaugh; and America.

    So much God talk at these sites.

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  31. Joe says:

    @Northerner:
    Civil suit would also be subject to a statute of limitations, probably 2 years.

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  32. Teve says:

    @CSK: the QAnon people are having a shit-fit, too.

    I’m just drinking in the tears of unfathomable sadness. 😀

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  33. Jay L Gischer says:

    Credit Where Credit is Due Dept:

    Michigan state Senate Majority Leader Mike Shirkey and House Speaker Lee Chatfield said in a joint statement, after meeting [not sure who] in Washington, DC that they had “not yet been made aware of any information that would change the outcome of the election in Michigan.”

    I’ve seen one outlet report that they asked Trump for more Covid relief while they were in town.

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  34. CSK says:

    @charon:
    Did you notice the claims of how God picked Trump to lead us? By that token, God must have chosen Joe Biden to follow Trump.

    I have to admit I laughed out loud at someone’s comment about how good a Christian Trump is. Seriously?

    @Teve:
    We laugh–justifiably–but it’s alarming how many people took QAnon seriously.

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  35. gVOR08 says:

    @Not the IT Dept.: True. But I was thinking more of scale. Goebbles controlled the press nationwide. Murdoch doesn’t have control, but has strong nationwide influence. Bannon’s news operation was on a much smaller scale.

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  36. Teve says:

    @CSK: what I’ve both read and experienced in real life is that intellectually-insecure people are tempted toward conspiracy theories. Secret, hidden knowledge makes them feel smarter than others.

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  37. gVOR08 says:

    Dyam, fat fingered Goebbels @gVOR08: and can’t get EDIT.

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  38. OzarkHillbilly says:

    @JohnMcC: And pretty impressive your memory of it. Never remember my dreams.

    I usually don’t, but this one stuck with me.

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  39. Not the IT Dept. says:

    @gVOR08:

    Control of the press came later.

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  40. Kathy says:

    @OzarkHillbilly:

    I had a spate of night cramps on the inside of the thighs, usually the right one, a few months back. The doctor I consulted said it might be an electrolyte imbalance, and suggested I eat a banana at least every other day (hence all the recent talk about bananas and banana coffee pancakes). They went away like that.

    I also changed my sleep position to my side rather than prone.

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  41. MarkedMan says:

    @Northerner: But that’s the beauty of her suit. If she sued him for rape, once the sex was proven it would be all about how she was a slut who threw himself at her. In this case, however, once the sex is proven she’s won her case.

    Also, police are specifically protected against civil cases that arise in pursuit of their duties.

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  42. Just nutha ignint cracker says:

    From late yesterday’s forum:

    If you need to shoot first, maybe you shouldn’t be a cop?

    I like it a lot because it’s really thoughtful. That may also be the problem–it requires thought to process. Also it doesn’t fit on a bumper sticker or a hat. This is the difference between left and right at the moment–maybe always having been that way, I dunno.

    Anyway comparing it to contemporary rightwing nutjobisms:
    “Back the Blue”
    “Make America Great Again”
    “All Lives Matter”
    “The Jews Will Not Replace Us”
    Or even the waaaaay more innocuous “Morning in America” of a generation or 3 back

    No thinking at all. The weakness of reform movements is the people have to think–and want to think and then realize the problem and then want to solve it and then buy agreement on the solution and then… Bigotry and hatred don’t require any of that. All they require is the default narcissism humans are born with. Slogans don’t form policy, they shortcut gridlock and inaction.

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  43. OzarkHillbilly says:

    @Kathy: I’ve tried everything, been tested 7 ways till Sunday. There are no magic bullets, no quick and easy cure for me. I eat bananas regularly, take magnesium supplements and drink a lot of water. I think they help, but nothing makes them go away. It’s been this way all my life, sometimes so severe I am literally begging my wife to shoot me. half a dozen or more different CHs up and down both my legs and in my hands, arms, chest and or back all at the same time. Badly bruised afterwards now with the blood thinners.

    It’s just the way it is.

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  44. CSK says:

    Scott Baio (Chachi) wants to replace Mitt Romney in the senate with himself.

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  45. OzarkHillbilly says:

    @grumpy realist:

    ‘A postscript: has Mr. Ramsland inadvertently stumbled across evidence of voter fraud in Minnesota? I seriously doubt it. The venues in question are all in red Greater Minnesota, not in the blue urban areas where voter fraud is common.

    Attorney John Hinderaker–president of a conservative think tank and Powerline blogger may be smart enough to catch that mistake, but he is still a RWNJ who believes in Santa Clause, the Tooth Fairy, and voter fraud that is common, especially in blue areas.

    Ignorant asshole.

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  46. Teve says:

    I get cramps that cause horrendously painful plantar flexion and the only thing that alleviates the pain is dorsiflexion, sometimes I have to grab my feet and manually bend them. It’s hellish.

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  47. Just nutha ignint cracker says:

    @OzarkHillbilly: Yow! I have similar dreams, not quite as exciting–no animals attacking me in the cab of my truck (no truck)–but long drawn out dreams with me trying to accomplish something and not being able to–over and over and over.

    I have them 2 or 3 times a week. I don’t use sleep inducing or pain relieving medications (okay, an occasional Tylenol, but 30 is a year’s supply). I think they’re a product of sleep disorder rather than drug induced. After over 5 years of them, I’ve just gotten used to the experience, but I have wondered if a session or 12 with a therapist might enlighten me at times.

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  48. Teve says:

    @Just nutha ignint cracker: anybody else have the dreams where you have to fight someone but your punches are as weak as if you’re underwater? Those are awful.

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  49. SenyorDave says:

    @charon: So much God talk at these sites.

    Always God, never Jesus. My theory is that Jesus has become persona non grata among the far right. After all, he did icky things like minister to the poor, speak out against those in power and gave a voice to the underprivileged.
    The Old Testament vengeful God is more the far right’s speed.

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  50. grumpy realist says:

    @Just nutha ignint cracker: melatonin supplements can do it for me. Also have heard some people get vivid dreams from B12 deficiency.

    (right now my standard dream is plowing through piles of prior art looking for certain technology and not finding it.)

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  51. OzarkHillbilly says:

    @Just nutha ignint cracker: Just ftr, the animals were not attacking me, they were just not happy and crawling all over me in an attempt to get out of the truck. I would really like to know where that comes from.

    @Teve: Commonly, but I have learned how to make the punches effective anyway. Don’t ask me how, I don’t know, but part of it has to be the fact that when I dream, I am very much aware that I am dreaming.

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  52. dmichael says:

    @Northerner: 1. Trump said she was a liar, not merely that she was mistaken or confused about a long ago event. 2. Statutes of Limitation on sex crimes.

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  53. grumpy realist says:

    P.S. Most of our dreams seem to be ways of processing memories of the day before. Add emotion and fears to it and it’s not surprising that a large number of our dreams are dealing with trying to repeat tasks and not succeeding. (Everyone has to have had the dream of trying to get to an exam in time and failing because you keep getting delayed by one emergency after another.)

    It’s the really weird dreams that cause you to wake up in the morning and say “WTF was that about?” (ah yes, the large green caterpillars with purple veins and red feet dropping on me from the ceiling….)

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  54. Just nutha ignint cracker says:

    @CSK: Meh… That’s pretty boilerplate dittohead thinking. The comment thread had this gem though:

    The [Republican] Gov of GA and the [Republican] SOS in no way want the Senate in Republican control and subject themselves to any kind of Senate investigation on voting irregularities [in their Republican-controlled state].

    That guy is where the disconnect from reality is. The caller is just a typical hamburger-for-brains Rushie.

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  55. Just nutha ignint cracker says:

    @James Joyner: Have a nice weekend!

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  56. Northerner says:

    @MarkedMan:

    But that’s the beauty of her suit. If she sued him for rape, once the sex was proven it would be all about how she was a slut who threw himself at her. In this case, however, once the sex is proven she’s won her case.

    I think Trump is a good target for this kind of case. However, I think its a really bad precedent for other cases — for instance, oil companies throwing SLAPP suits against environmental protesters. They already do that of course, but it gives them a new angle — claim the protesters are slandering them. Even if its false, the protester having to prove they honestly believed they were innocent could quickly run up a lot of lawyer time — that’s the point of SLAPP suits.

    Also, police are specifically protected against civil cases that arise in pursuit of their duties.

    You misunderstand what I’m trying (apparently not very clearly) say — in fact what I’m concerned about is the exact opposite of your statement. I’m not worried about the police being sued (has that ever worked anywhere?), I’m worried about the police officer and/or department suing the person they arrested for claiming to be innocent, if claiming to be innocent can be considered slander against your accuser. Or how about if someone is arrested and claims police brutality, and then the police sue that person for slander (ie the police department argues that the arrested person is knowingly lying about unnecessary force being used). For a poor person with little legal funds, having to fight the slander suit (ie having to prove they honestly believed it was unnecessary force) would be prohibitively expensive even if they eventually won.

    These kind of “what did the person truly believe” suits are great if you have resources or backing for legal expenses, but a nightmare for poor people. Its the same reason many innocent poor people plead guilty to things they didn’t do — they can’t afford to prove they were innocent in court.

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  57. Northerner says:

    @dmichael:

    1. Trump said she was a liar, not merely that she was mistaken or confused about a long ago event. 2. Statutes of Limitation on sex crimes.

    That its about his calling her a liar and not merely his claiming innocence is somewhat of a relief. If there’s a statute of limitation on sex crimes (for some reason I thought that they, like murder, had no time limit), then wouldn’t that apply to the slander charge as well?

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  58. Just nutha ignint cracker says:

    @CSK:

    By that token, God must have chosen Joe Biden to follow Trump.

    No, that’s the Forces of Evil, The Devil, and all his empty promises, retaliating against the righteousness of God, making the proper Christian response doubling down on opposing the newly elected government–permitted by God to test the faithful.

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  59. Just nutha ignint cracker says:

    @SenyorDave: You may be onto something.

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  60. Michael Reynolds says:

    @Just nutha ignint cracker: @grumpy realist:
    I don’t dream, or at least I don’t remember them. I used to when I was a kid, and through young adulthood. I suspect dream activity dropped off after I started writing. My subconscious has a paying job, it’s not going to waste time spinning stories for free.

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  61. Michael Reynolds says:

    @Just nutha ignint cracker:
    It’s like how hurricanes used to be all about God hating the gays, but now hurricanes are just weather events. As soon as a Democrat’s in office, hurricanes go right back to being a punishment for liberalism.

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  62. CSK says:

    @Northerner:
    There’s a 1-3 year statute of limitations on filing for defamation in all states.

    @Just nutha ignint cracker:
    Thank you. As I’ve mentioned before, I wasn’t raised in any religion, so my acquaintance with these theological nuances is seriously limited.

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  63. CSK says:

    @Just nutha ignint cracker:
    Yeah, I saw that. I would have been taken aback by it, but for quite a long time the MAGAheads have been fuming about how they hate all Republicans because they’re not sufficiently subservient to and adoring of Trump. Apparently Brian Kemp, whom they loved when he was running against Stacy Abrams, is now a RINO lickspittle traitor.

    I wouldn’t be surprised if the ardent Trumpkins form their own party.

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  64. gVOR08 says:

    @Just nutha ignint cracker: By that token,

    God must have chosen Joe Biden to follow Trump.

    No, that’s the Forces of Evil, The Devil, and all his empty promises, retaliating against the righteousness of God, …

    Trump, President of the United States, most powerful man in the world, is constantly whining about being thwarted by the deep state or Democrats or the press or something. And the Trumpskyites buy it. Apparently our omniscient, omnipotent God gets the same deal.

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  65. Mister Bluster says:

    Dreams
    When I was in grade school I had a recurring dream that started with me standing stark naked in the middle of the day down the street in front of the house where a girl that I liked lived with her family. It was all I could do to run home in my bare feet before anyone saw me. I think I woke up before I got back to my driveway.
    Years later there were the acid dreams when I was very much awake.

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  66. OzarkHillbilly says:

    @Northerner: @CSK: And he called her a liar recently where as the rape occurred 20 years or so ago.

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  67. CSK says:

    @OzarkHillbilly:
    Then she has a year to file her claim, which she’s already done.

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  68. OzarkHillbilly says:

    @CSK: Yes, but you hadn’t stated explicitly that the defamation was recent, just implied it via stating the statute of limitations. Didn’t mean to step on any toes.

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  69. CSK says:

    @OzarkHillbilly:
    You didn’t step on mine. In fact I should have made that point clearer.

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  70. OzarkHillbilly says:

    @CSK: Good, even tho it would be uncharacteristic of you, I thought I might have.

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  71. Just nutha ignint cracker says:

    @CSK: If you just remember that evangelicals currently lead dominionist in their theology and contextualize every statement as “how does X help them justify their continued attempts to dictate conduct for the population at large,” it’s relatively easy to keep it all straight. I’d rather it be easy by some other measure–such as the degree of humility in service to God or something–but you work under the constraints there are, not the ones you wish for. (A important government official said something similar a while back, but I’m spotty on the details now.)

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  72. Just nutha ignint cracker says:

    @CSK: Yes, we can hope for that. A Trumpist party beyond Republicanism could soon turn into the kind of boon the right experienced as the left was fragmenting back post Vietnam.

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  73. CSK says:

    @OzarkHillbilly:
    Nope. All’s well.
    @Just nutha ignint cracker:
    It’s a lack in me that I know so little about religion in general, except for what I absorbed about medieval Catholicism when I was doing my doctorate, but I’ve forgotten most of that.
    @Just nutha ignint cracker:
    At this point, the Trumpkins are never going to be happy within the confines of the traditional Republican party, which they see as just as elitist and dismissive of them as are the Democrats. With Trump, they have the illusion of being in control. They won’t give that up easily.

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  74. dazedandconfused says:

    @Just nutha ignint cracker:

    Yes. Some minority must be scapegoated is always Rule 1 in agitprop.

    Trump scapegoats race successfully and in other matters. However he stands on the shoulders of giants. The planted impression that China came over and, with the aid of (of course!) the DemocRATS, forced US industry to off-shore themselves to China has taken deep root.

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  75. Angel says:

    @CSK: Have a complete computer forensic analysis performed on your computer – it reveals the criminal activity of child predators that exposes you to criminal charges under the law of probable cause, then research ownership of the illegal websites. Then pick up your jaw from the floor (after it falls) and it reveals who the criminals are.
    Who the FBI has been aiding and abetting for decades….as innocent people are being arrested.
    Then talk sideways out of your mouth.
    It really isn’t rocket science” but it reveals the magnitude of “sick” corruption that most certainly exists. Tangible evidence doesn’t lie. People do and then you have those who can’t take the truth ….and talk “smack”!

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  76. JohnSF says:

    @CSK:
    I still have a weird suspicion about Q-anon: that it’s, at least in part, a “proof-of-concept” test.

    (Arggh! Meta-conspiracy theory about a conspiracy theory. Mind dissolves in feedback loop. Paging Robert Anton Wilson.)

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  77. OzarkHillbilly says:

    @Gustopher: It sounds like you want to make the police stronger, and sort of we do, but we also want to reign them in and only have them do the jobs we need armed jackbooted thugs for, letting social workers do the others.

    Finally got around to reading the rest of yesterday’s open forum posts after my last comment, and I just want to say that most of what I read was branding exercises as cover for “reform” which the folks stating as such may have thought would be serious but as I stated has never been anything more than an empty slogan and another dead black body. I want real solutions to real problems. I think getting rid of qualified immunity would be a good start. Another would be getting rid of “armed jackbooted thugs”. 9 times out of ten just the appearance of a badge changes the complexion of a situation, but a cop has to allow for that change to come to fruition. Too often I have seen “you must respect my authority” take over a confrontation when just a couple minutes of talk would de-escalate 99% of such situations.

    I have been in situations where I should have gone to jail, possibly with a beat down, but didn’t. While I don’t know, I’m pretty damned sure being white had something to do with it. One time a cop spent a good 10 minutes just letting me vent. Tell me that most cops allow for that with a black man and I have some beach front property to sell.

    PS: I ain’t picking on you Gustopher, just that your comment was illustrative.

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  78. CSK says:

    @JohnSF:
    This is interesting; tell me more.

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  79. Michael Cain says:

    The latest (R) tactic in Michigan has the RNC and the Michigan party sending a letter to the state certification board asking that they not certify the count for two weeks so that an audit can be conducted. The Sec of State has pointed out that Michigan law allows an audit only after the vote is certified. That’s some catch, that catch-22.

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  80. reid says:

    @charon: Yes. I take nexium daily, and only recently discovered that it can cause magnesium deficiency. A symptom of that is “restless leg”, especially at night. (Maybe cramping, too.) Magnesium supplements really do seem to help. Such a simple cure, had I known the connection earlier.

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  81. Kathy says:

    So, I got Disney+ and have been watching TV all day.

    The good news is I found a KN95 mask that fits. Some months ago, a coworker gave me one which fit well. After the fiasco last month, I had the brilliant idea “why not look for the ones that I know work?” Fortunately, they have the model stamped on one side.

    I looked that up online, found several sellers, and ordered a 25 piece set for about $35. I figure if I put them in a plastic bag after each use and expose them to the Sun for 20 days, they should be safe enough to reuse.

    I estimate vaccines may be available by February or March, if we’re lucky. With cases going up and winter starting, it’s time to increase precautions.

    Wouldn’t I feel really stupid if I got sick, never mind died, when relief is clearly on the way?

    On a lighter topic, I got some “tea”* at the store. Apple-cinnamon, spearmint, and chocolate mint (or so it claims to be). They’re to have at work between morning and afternoon coffee.

    *My understanding is that if it doesn’t come from the tea plant, it’s not real tea but rather an herbal infusion. Of course, we still call it tea.

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  82. JohnSF says:

    @CSK:
    Post from few days back:

    Actually sort of relates to a semi-formed idea that’s wandering around in the vast and dreary desert of my skull.

    Has to do with Q-anon.

    Q-anon, as has been pointed out by some game designers, is self-evolving via its adherents, but has a core which is designed, and a infrastructure that involves some serious costs (not multi-millions but in the high tens to hundreds of thousands of dollars).
    Who is paying, and why?
    Proof of concept of designed religio-political mental conditioning?

    Q-anon is so useful: what better than an enemy that will always be there to mobilise the believing base; it can never go away because it never exited in the first place.
    And that fantasy enemy can then be identified with whatever actual opponents you have at any point.

    Also recalls something I once came across re. a difference between fascists and nazis: former were (sometimes) interested in state structures; latter were far more driven by enemies, who were real people, but fantasised into demonic opponents.

    The potential of politically exploiting irrationality looks like it might become a major topic of the 21st century.

    “Nothing is True: Everything is Permissable”

    Probably nothing in it and I’m over-connecting again.

    As for Robert Anton Wilson, there’s a rabbit hole worth scampering down.
    Hilarity ensues.

    YouGottaBelieveMe! Fnord.

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  83. Teve says:
  84. DrDaveT says:

    @Just nutha ignint cracker:

    I like it a lot because it’s really thoughtful. That may also be the problem–it requires thought to process.

    Oh, I agree completely. But it’s hard to find a visceral emotional appeal to not be evil.

    Shame might work better… How about “Only criminals shoot first.” ?

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  85. charon says:

    @CSK:

    At this point, the Trumpkins are never going to be happy within the confines of the traditional Republican party, which they see as just as elitist and dismissive of them as are the Democrats. With Trump, they have the illusion of being in control. They won’t give that up easily.

    Trump has plans to keep drawing attention to himself:

    https://www.washingtonpost.com/politics/trump-2024-rematch/2020/11/21/58ce87ac-2a8d-11eb-8fa2-06e7cbb145c0_story.html

    Trump privately plots his next act

    In a nod to the reality that he is destined to leave office in January, the president is seriously contemplating life beyond the White House, telling advisers that he wants to remain an omnipresent force in politics and the media — perhaps by running for the White House again.

    One adviser who recently spoke with the president said that Trump told him he planned to announce a new campaign in three weeks, and that he wanted to act quickly to try to freeze the large field of prospective 2024 Republican presidential candidates.

    Trump has been bragging to confidants that he secured more votes than any Republican presidential candidate in history — although he trails Biden in the national popular vote by about 6 million — and that he believes he has leverage because he thinks anyone who wants a future in Republican politics will have to “kiss the ring,” said a second adviser.

    Through sheer fear or admiration, Trump could easily be the most sought-after Republican surrogate in the 2022 midterm elections. But people close to him said the president is unlikely to play the traditional role of a politician collecting chits to ensure loyalty in advance of a White House run. He is not expected to spend much time traveling to early nominating states such as Iowa and New Hampshire or supporting down-ballot Republican candidates with money and surrogate appearances, these people said.

    Instead, Trump has shown interest in maintaining a political operation and keeping control of the party apparatus in other ways. In the past, when presidents left office, there have been open elections for leadership positions in their party. But Trump tweeted recently, without being prompted, that he supported his ally, Ronna McDaniel, serving another term as chair of the Republican National Committee.

    Republicans both privately and publicly worry that Trump — who has shown little affinity toward his chosen party and largely appears to act almost exclusively in his self-interest — could be more likely to play a meddling and damaging role than a helpful one.

    A senior administration official who has spoken recently with the president said that while it was “very difficult” to predict what Trump might do, there is “a very high percentage chance that he leaves the door open for him to run for a long time, for the next couple of years.”

    This official added that “you will not persuade him that he should change his time frame on making any decision based on what’s quote unquote best for the party. He doesn’t care. We could find ourselves deep into a 2024 election cycle, into mid-2023, and he still hasn’t definitely said he’s not running and you’re just going to see all these 2024 potential contenders uncertain about what to do.”

    I think he has at most a year or two of these antics before health issues including senile dementia make him clearly non-viable.

    Plus NY state AG might also have some input re his plans.

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  86. CSK says:

    @charon:
    I hope he’s prevented from doing anything but living out his remaining time in utter disgrace.

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  87. charon says:

    @CSK:

    That would require fewer and less persistently loyal public followers than seems likely, but we will see after January.

    https://twitter.com/davenewworld_2/status/1330079395483164673

    Trump supporters in Georgia vow to destroy the Republican Party if Trump doesn’t win

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  88. Monala says:

    @Kathy: what brand of K95 masks? I’ve seen complaints about the ear straps being too short to stay on for several brands.

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  89. Kathy says:

    @Monala:

    I’m not sure what the brand is, but the model is VIC 824 KN95.

    The straps are a bit short, and the mask feels tight, but I figure that’s good as it creates a better seal.

    The first one I wore for about three hours and had no complaints. I wore a second one today (the package arrived yesterday) for about as long without any trouble. I’ll let you know more Monday when I wear one all day at the office.

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  90. Teve says:

    Alice Wu:

    A note from abroad: Realizing now that I’ve been 5 days out of US that many folks back home don’t realize how other countries might be living with the ‘Rona. Here is what it was like to come to Taiwan. I think we could maybe learn a coupla things… /1 #COVID
    Upon our plane touching down in TPE, we were immediately placed in two lines: one for folks with a working intl cell phone, one for the rest of us (to buy a very affordable local SIM card.) The government is then able to track us while we are in the country /2 #ContactTracing
    Once through immigration and baggage, we are required to take govt-approved covid-safe cars to our quarantine hotels. (If you are a local, you can self-isolate at home.) No leaving your room (or home) for 15 days. Not for walks- nothing. /3
    At the hotel: meals are left outside your door three times a day. There is no contact with anyone. Every day, you get a call from the health department asking if you have any symptoms. If so, they will immediately rush you to the hospital for care. /4

    As a sidebar, I have discovered that I am weirdly okay having all my daily living decisions made for me. Have not yet gone crazy confined within four walls. Perhaps I would have made a good housepet. /5
    Never mind about domesticity, after 15 days, you are free to go. For 7 more days, you are required to check your temperature every morning (they actually gift you a thermometer) and someone calls every day to make sure you’re okay. /6
    Because most local citizens have voluntarily signed up for contact tracing (and all of us foreigners are required to opt-in) should a case break out, anyone who was in significant contact would be notified, then required to self-isolate for a number of days. /7
    At any point, if you break quarantine – which they can tell by the movements of your phone – you could be fined 10-30k. They are quite serious on this point. Then again, they haven’t had a case in 200 days. And everyone has been living their lives freely since February./8
    A note on contact tracing: I’m no expert, and historically a proponent of privacy, but if you have a credit card, or downloaded any number of apps, it seems “they” already have your info. So in a gosh-darn pandemic: sign up for contact tracing! /9
    Again, not an expert. But again: EVERYONE IN TAIWAN HAS BEEN LIVING THEIR LIVES FREELY SINCE FEBRUARY! I mean yes, people voluntarily wear masks in public places, but otherwise, restaurants, subways, etc are packed. So…. /10

    I guess this could have been our lives too? Food for thought… /end

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  91. Teve says:

    “If President Trump comes out and says: ‘Guys, I have irrefutable proof of fraud, the courts won’t listen, and I’m now calling on Americans to take up arms,’ we would go,” said Fryar, wearing a button-down shirt, pressed slacks and a paisley tie during a recent interview at his office.

    linky

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