Birtherism By Any Other Name At Red State
Writing about the same story that I posted about earlier today, one of the diarists at Red State says this:
Barack Obama was born in Hawaii.
There’s still information that the public should know but does not know-information any employer would ask for and receive.
Where are the college transcripts? Did Barack Obama apply to Occidental College as a foreign student and did he live in foreign student housing? Did he apply to Columbia University as a foreign student? Did he apply to Harvard Law School as a foreign student? What types of student loans did he receive?
What was Barack Obama when he went to public school for several years (ages 6 to 10) in Indonesia? Did he become a citizen of Indonesia?
I’ve been hearing this almost as long as the whole birther myth has been prevalent, and it’s usually the same people pushing both memes. We need to see the college transcripts, we’re told, because President Obama may have relied upon a scholarship for foreign students when he went to college. We need to see his records from Indonesia because he might have been adopted and become an Indonesian citizen, even though U.S. law specifically states that a parent cannot renounce a child’s U.S. Citizenship on their behalf. It all comes from the same idea, that Barack Obama is foreign, that he’s the other and that he’s somehow not legitimate. It’s nonsense, and it needs to stop.
H/T: Balloon Juice
Doug;
THere’s only one solid way to both discredit the arguments and those who would pose them… something you…. and the left, understandably…. are desperate to do…. but they won’t do… produce the proof…. without excuses and without equivocations
.
The question, logically can be asked… why won’t they?
THere’s only one solid answer for that, as well.
Yes, both solid and obvious: the birther nuts are an absolute godsend for the Obama administration and help to discredit opponents more generally. If you didn’t exist, they’d have to invent you. Not that releasing one more document would be likely to quiet the crazies, but why would they take any risks with their best asset?
@ Eric Florack–A thought for you about proof. “For those who believe, no proof is necessary. For those who don’t believe, no proof is possible.” Get over youself. When I applied for my passport some years back, I presented a signed, sealed government document titled FACSIMILE OF ORIGINAL BIRTH CERTIFICATE as proof of my identity and citizenship. My mother is Irish, does that mean I’m not a citizen either? And how do I know that YOUR a citizen–Florack sounds like a foreign name to me………….
Of course, you can settle this argument about yourself. Show us YOUR birth certificate.
Except, Eric, that assumes there is any credit in the arguments to begin with. Obama has shown more than any other President in history was asked to, and he has shown all that was ever necessary. Why should he kowtow to the frenzied whining of a bunch of malcontents and idiots?
You have to pardon Eric. Just a few short weeks ago, the right was basking in the afterglow of a big mid term win, predicting a new world order at hand. After the pasting Obama laid on them in the lame duck session, and more and more signs pointing to a significantly improved economy, well, he has to talk about something…
Stupid birther He starts off by saying that Obama was born in Hawaii. What kind of birther opens up the argument by admitting the obvious?
It’s worth noting just how much of Obama’s past he’s kept private. When he ran for the US Senate, his staff urged reporters to dig into the divorce and CHILD CUSTODY agreements of his oppoent, Jack Ryan. Similarly, when John Roberts was up for nomination to the Supreme Court, there was a push to unseal the adoption records of his son.
Meanwhile, Obama’s college transcripts. thesis, and even his legislative files — all of ’em — from his stint in the Illinois legislature and even his teaching records remain under lock and key.
My own pet theory is that Obama keeps the birth stuff secret so the nuts will keep obsessing over that, and give him cover to keep other stuff quiet — as well as keeping the nuts focused on the trivial stuff and not looking at other, more potentially embarrassing matters.
If the birthers didn’t exist, Obama would probably have to invent them — they’re that useful.
I mean, look at this article. The guy even opened by stating he was not a birther, and Doug still labeled him as such. Is there anything more useful for Obama apologists and lapdogs?
J.
“My own pet theory is that Obama keeps the birth stuff secret so the nuts will keep obsessing over that, and give him cover to keep other stuff quiet — as well as keeping the nuts focused on the trivial stuff and not looking at other, more potentially embarrassing matters.”
Well, if such is the case, it has certainly worked brilliantly, considering the comments from people around here as well as their fellow travelers…
“The guy even opened by stating he was not a birther…”
Indeed, and then the guy went on to ask if the president became a citizen of Indonesia at some point or if he applied to various colleges/universities as a foreign student…like Doug wrote, birtherism by any other name…
Of course it does. But on what basis would you not consider it so? Because by chance you don’t like the implications?
It comes down to this; If he is eligible for the office, then the proof should be forthcoming, offered by a wiling Obama, since it would give him a massive advantage, having discredited totally, and factually, his attackers. Why on earth would he not avail himself of that advantage?
The most obvious reason would be such proof does not exist, or worse, it proves the case of his attackers.
No, Eric, simply shutting down his attackers on this issue would free them up to find other, potentially more productive, angles of attack. Stonewalling on this one — knowing full well that should he ever have to cave, he’d still win — keeps them tied up on an ultimately futile struggle.
I’ve seen estimates that Obama has spent between one and two million dollars to keep his birth records locked up. That has certainly been money very well spent. I dunno if it was deliberate or just a happy circumstance that developed on its own, but either way he’s played it brilliantly.
Just to bring up Doug’s favorite topic, look at how much we know about Sarah Palin’s background and life vs. Obama’s. Hers is an open book, especially compared to his. And she was a defeated vice-presidential candidate, while he is the sitting President of the United States. Further, she’s three years younger.
Money very well spent, indeed.
J.
> Further, she’s three years younger.
Proof positive that something is very seriously wrong here…
The weird thing (or, one of the weird things) about the transcript demand is that of the college transcripts I have seen (and I have seen my fair share given my profession and from having served on a number of hiring committees) they do not list how your education was paid for and they certainly don’t show what dorm you lived in.
It is utterly bogus ti suggest that transcripts would even contain the information in question.
Ahhhh, but the desperate and the delusional perhaps hope that those transcripts provide something, anything that could embarrass the president…
> Yes, Barack Obama was born in Hawaii. We knew that.
Pretty amazing stuff. We concede that he is, in fact a citizen. Yet we are going to continue to churn out a bunch of nonsense about “foreign student housing” because we know that the JT’s & Bitheads of the world will lap it up like cream.
I’ve had to go through a couple of fairly extensive background checks. No one ever expressed ANY interest in what dorm I did or did not live in.
If you are Red State, I guess writing this stuff is better that dealing with how rapidly the newly minted tea party congresspersons to be are being assimilated into the beltway culture.
My pet theory on why Obama won’t release his colllege records: it’s a repeat of 2004, when elitist Boston Brahmin and super-genius John Forbes Kerry turned out to have a marginally lower GPA than super-idiot George W. Bush. I suspect Obama’s undergraduate grades were pretty mediocre at best.
Speaking of which, it’s been about six years now since John Kerry promised to fully release his military service records… and he ain’t. (No, I ain’t counting “showing them to two or three hand-selected reporters, including his biographer” as “fully releasing.”) Glad I didn’t hold my breath.
Gosh, you Democrats just LOVE them Men of Mystery, don’cha? Someone oughta sic Julian Assange or the guys who dug out Jack Ryan’s child-custody documents or George W. Bush’s DWI arrest on the case…
J.
No, Eric. Because the allegations have, by any reasonable standard, been shown to be untrue.
The key word there is “reasonable”, which is possibly why you may be having trouble.
That explains his attending Occidental, Columbia and Harvard Law, none of which are known for letting in slackers… Oh, wait! It’s a snide attempt at implying affirmative action and thus not being properly qualified.
You sly old dog, Jay Tea; here I was, thinking you were just a jerk, when in fact you’re being a crypto-racist.
Bite me, Mike. And spell it right — it’s “RAAAAACIST.” The five A’s and the all-caps are mandatory.
Further, I’m not a crypto-anything. I don’t bother with hidden agendas and motives — too much of a pain to keep straight.
Feel free to prove me wrong on his grades. He’s admitted he wasn’t that interested in schoolwork as an undergrad, and there are quite a few other criteria besides grades that colleges use for admission — areas where Obama excels.
Look how long it took Kerry to release his academic records, and he still hasn’t released his military records. And last time I checked, John Forbes Kerry was white — whiter than white, actually; a Boston Brahmin.
And to reiterate, Mike: Bite me.
J.
Hey, if the hood fits…
Got any UFO theories to share J?
No, anjin, but I heard a really good one about alien abductions…
Mike, you’re the racist. You can’t accept that many people’s problems with Obama have NOTHING to do with his race (if you wanna be particular, half his race). You set up a nice double standard: what we find troubling in him ought to be acceptable BECAUSE he’s black (or half-black). We shouldn’t apply the same standards that we would to white politicians.
So take your hood, your snide implications, and bullshit allegations and shove ’em up your ass. Whatever color said ass happens to be.
J.
I’ve seen estimates that Obama has spent between one and two million dollars to keep his birth records locked up.
If you heard it on the internet, it must be true! What a pathetic person you have become.
If there was nothing to hide, documents would be released. This bogus excuse of ID protection is ridiculous. Nobody would dare to use Obama’s birth certificate as their own, people. Or his school records. He’s just a little too high profile.
Aw, mantis. It’s touching, how you still care.
J.
Mantis has a good point J. You are very thin on supporting documentation. When you put that on top of being thin on reason, logic and being well informed – well, you are downright skinny, and not in a way that flatters you. Are you just a gadfly, or do you have any interest in being taken seriously?
anjin, mantis has an utterly irrelevant point. The precise amount Obama has spent fighting the Birthers is quite possibly impossible to determine — some of it was probably paid as a retainer, not for actual fee for services. What is relevant is how he has fought them — and how preserving that fight has worked to his advantage.
As far as being taken seriously… I know you won’t ever admit to it, so I don’t bother myself with trying to win you over or even getting you to acknowledge that you do. mantis, I have too many years of liking and appreciating him to get angry with him. I prefer to talk past you, to the other readers who might be spared for falling into this LGF Lite pit. In that context, you and your brethren (wr, matt, even Doug, among others) are useful tools.
Thanks for serving as such useful props. Couldn’t have better straw men than if I stuffed ’em myself.
J.
> I prefer to talk past you,
The fact that you address me personally on a daily basis pretty much shows that to be nonsense.
> The precise amount Obama has spent fighting the Birthers is quite possibly impossible to determine
you threw out a number all buy yourself, don’t start crying because people ask you to actually support your statements. You talk a great deal, but you don’t seem to actually know too much of anything. Simply repeating right wing bromides – well, you said you are not concerned about being taken seriously, so I guess its just not an issue for you.
anjin, you’re pretty good at that particular rhetorical device — focus entirely on the irrelevant part of an issue so you can ignore the truly significant.
In the Joe the Plumber case, the particulars behind who and what Joe was (yes, I’m aware that legally, “Joe” isn’t even his “real name — how DARE Samuel Joseph prefer to go by his middle name!) don’t really matter. What was significant was not who he was or the factual basis of his question, but Obama’s answer — which was so revealing that it must be buried at any price, including breaking the law and violating Mr. Wurzelbacher’s right to privacy by state officials who went digging for dirt on the guy to discredit him and make his “lies” the most important thing.
In this case, what’s signficant is Obama’s active efforts in refusing to release his birth records, not whether I can provide a precise dollar amount and exact accounting of just how much he’s spent doing so. As noted, he has at his disposal a very easy remedy to make the whole thing go away in a puff of smoke (so to speak), but he refuses. Which makes it clear that he sees an advantage in keeping the controversy alive and unresolved. My own theory, as stated and re-stated above: he likes that it keeps a chunk of his foes fixated on it as it’s far more harmful to them than him, and not on other matters. And even if they eventually do win their fight to get to the “proof” they demand to see, it won’t do him any harm.
So, how much has Obama spent to keep his birth records sealed? I repeat myself: I don’t know, but it certainly has been money well spent. If only he could channel that kind of fiscal acumen into his job performance, perhaps he wouldn’t have tripled the deficit since he took office.
J.
As noted, he has at his disposal a very easy remedy to make the whole thing go away in a puff of smoke (so to speak), but he refuses.
If you saw it on the internet, it must be true!
The State of Hawaii issues a certain type of birth certificate to people requesting a copy of theirs. The Obama campaign released that document long before the election. He isn’t holding back documents at all.
So, how much has Obama spent to keep his birth records sealed?
Nothing. His lawyers have filed motions to dismiss frivolous lawsuits filed by people with no standing, no evidence, and no brains. He has no control over records maintained by the State of Hawaii, and hasn’t taken a single action to “seal” them or keep them “sealed.” He has, in face, released the only record the state issues to citizens. That document is good enough to get a passport from the State Department, but apparently doesn’t meet the stringent standards of crazy people.
Stupid ass birther.
I am not a birther.
I want to see all his records including his admission requests to all college and post graduate schools.
Fact:
his grandmother says he was born in Kenya…
Is his grandmother is senile?
Hawaii became a state in 1959 and so in 1961 it was still in a state of flux.
Why did his mom move there from Kenya…that is not even close to Kansas…
Perhaps the birth registration system was easy to get over on.
He has spent big dollars to lock up his records!
Why what was his thinking… if he had nothing to hide why do so???
I think the people who elected Mr. Obama need to be informed!
RFITZ07
I miss the old mantis. The old mantis would remember me going on a tear, ripping to shreds some birthers who tried to bring their bullshit into Wizbang. The old mantis would give me credit for doing that, would acknowledge that I have stated — repeatedly and vehemently — that I believe that Obama was born in Hawaii, is fully and Constitutionally qualified to hold his office, and that he is (despite my efforts) my president, and will remain (I sincerely hope) my president until at least January 2013 (and no longer, I hope). I’ve never had one bit of tolerance for the birthers, and never will. (Well, I haven’t gone all Charles Johnson and banned people for bringing it up, so I guess I am “tolerant” of them, but I’ve always led the charge in attacking and mocking and denigrating them.)
I see a way in which Obama benefits from the birther movement, and I don’t like it. And I don’t like the philosophy behind some of the more self-styled “intellectuals” of the birther movement, who want to impose a two-tiered structure in born Americans based on their choice of parents. They piss me off, and I make a special point of kicking them when they find me — and, occasionally, luring them into kicking range.
If you see the old mantis, give him my regards.
J.
The old mantis would remember me going on a tear, ripping to shreds some birthers who tried to bring their bullshit into Wizbang.
I do remember. That’s why it’s so sad you’ve become one of them. You believe at least some of the bullshit they believe, with no evidence whatsoever. You believe Obama possesses documents he does not, which the State of Hawaii does not issue, and you believe “estimates” of him spending millions to keep his birth records “locked up” have some veracity, despite the fact that his campaign released the only birth document the state would issue long ago.
It’s as if I said I believe the twin towers were brought down by terrorists, but I have serious questions about how fire can melt steel, and whether there was controlled demolition charges in place, and why the government is hiding all sorts of information from us, including videos of a missile hitting the pentagon. Hey, don’t call me a truther! That’s outrageous!
I would say I miss the Jay Tea I remember that looked upon dubious claims with a skeptical eye, and had an interest in the facts, but I don’t really remember you that way.
(In case anyone is confused, I believe the above truther claims are crap.)
“Is his grandmother is senile?”
The irony…it burns…