Wednesday’s Forum

James Joyner
About James Joyner
James Joyner is Professor and Department Head of Security Studies at Marine Corps University's Command and Staff College. He's a former Army officer and Desert Storm veteran. Views expressed here are his own. Follow James on Twitter @DrJJoyner.


  1. Scott says:

    I posted something similar yesterday. Seems to be a pattern. With all the right wing congressmen banging on about Antifa, it would appear there are both sides.

    Far-right groups like the “Boogaloo” and “O9A” continue to attract troops and veterans

    As protesters have taken to the streets this month to call for racial justice and police reform, in the wake of the alleged murder of George Floyd by Minneapolis police, another movement has made headlines for all the wrong reasons. Its name is Boogaloo.

    Two weeks after the FBI arrested an Army reservist and two veterans, one of the Navy and the other the Air Force, for planning to incite violence at a Las Vegas protest, an active-duty airman shot and killed a federal security officer in Oakland, California.

    All four, according to their online activity, identified with the far-right group, which is loosely tied to anti-government and white-supremacist beliefs, but mostly advocates for an armed insurrection― of whatever kind― in general.

    Following multiple hearings on the issue, Congress has made a move: proposing in the latest House version of the 2021 National Defense Authorization Act bill that DoD start tracking and reporting white supremacist activity in the military, in addition to other extremist behavior or criminal gang affiliations.

    We’ll see if this stays in the bill or will be cut because of political correctness.

    I do know one thing: The Boogaloos are going to ruin wearing Hawaiian shirts.

  2. sam says:

    From a twitter feed:

    “Aunt Jemima was canceled… She was the picture of the American dream. She was a freed slave who went on to be the face of the pancake syrup.” — A student at Trump’s event on Tuesday


    This young woman reminds me of a (college) student of mine who said in front of the whole class that slaves were paid minimum wage and that they “voted” to fight against the Union in the Civil War.
    She also had never heard of time zones.

  3. Scott says:

    It is said that animals can predict when bad things are going to happen, like earthquakes and storms. Sometimes it is useful to watch people’s behavior to get a sense if bad things are going on or about to happen. After all, by and large, people look after themselves first.

    Early warning signs for the fate of this administration?

    Pentagon’s top tech experts, Griffin and Porter, resign

    The Pentagon’s top two technology experts have submitted their resignations.

    Mike Griffin, who became the Defense Department’s first undersecretary of research and engineering in early 2018, and his deputy Lisa Porter have both submitted their resignations, a defense official confirmed to Defense News. The two will be exiting the building July 10.

    They become the third and fourth officials to submit resignations in the last week. On June 16, Elaine McCusker, the department’s acting comptroller, submitted her resignation, followed two days later by Kathryn Wheelbarger, the acting assistant defense secretary for international security affairs.

  4. Liberal Capitalist says:

    I just found out that I am “Gen Jones”. I always thought the term was “Tweener”.

    Which is nice. As I have never been able to identify with the “Baby Boomer” generation.

  5. OzarkHillbilly says:

    @Scott: Rats… Sinking ships….

  6. Teve says:


    Trump at this point is the Charlie Sheen warlock tour saying He has tiger blood and is Winning

  7. OzarkHillbilly says:

    via commentor Mousebumples at Balloon Juice:

    Stanley Krute

    We need @JoeBiden. We need a mensch.

    From Rabbi Michael Beals of Delaware :

    “The story I’m about to share with you about Joe Biden is special — in fact, I’m fairly certain I’m the only living person left who actually witnessed it firsthand.

    It was about 16 years ago, and I was a young rabbi, brand-new to Delaware, on my way to lead a shiva minyan — a worship service following a death of a Jewish person. I was from California. Back then, I didn’t know Claymont, Delaware from Scranton, Pennsylvania.

    Quick bit of background: When someone passes away in the Jewish faith, we observe seven days of mourning, called shiva. We gather a group of ten Jewish adults together to say the Mourners’ Kaddish. It usually happens in a person’s home — somewhere intimate.

    In this case, the deceased individual — her name was Mrs. Greenhouse, of blessed memory — had not been a person of means. She had lived in rent-controlled senior housing in a tall high-rise building off of Namaans Road.

    Her apartment was too small to fit everyone into, so we conducted our worship service in the building’s communal laundry room, in the basement of the high-rise.

    We assembled the 10 elders together, and it was in this most humble of places that I began to lead kaddish.

    Toward the end of the service, a door at the back of the laundry room opened; who walks in but Sen. Joe Biden, head lowered, all by himself.

    I nearly dropped my prayer book in shock.

    Senator Biden stood quietly in the back of the room for the duration of the service.

    At the close of the kaddish, I walked over to him and asked the same question that must have been on everyone else’s mind: “Sen. Biden — what are you doing here?”

    He said to me: “Back in 1972, when I first ran for Senate, Mrs. Greenhouse gave $18 to my first campaign.

    Because that’s what she could afford. And every six years, when I’d run for reelection, she’d give another $18. She did it her whole life. I’m here to show my respect and gratitude.”

    Now, the number 18 is significant in the Jewish faith — its numbers spell out the Hebrew word chai, as in “to life, to life, l’chayim!” But it’s also a humble amount. Joe Biden knew that. And he respected that.

    There were no news outlets at our service that day — no Jewish reporters or important dignitaries. Just a few elderly mourners in a basement laundry room.

    Joe Biden didn’t come to that service for political gain. He came to that service because he has character.

    He came to that service because he’s a mensch.

    And if we need anything right now when it comes to the leadership of our country — we need a mensch.

    I know this is such a simple, small story. But I tell it to as many people as will listen to me.

    Because I think that, in their heart of hearts, when people are trying to think about the decision they’ll make this year — this is the kind of story that matters.

    Joe Biden is a mensch. We need a mensch.”

    Thank you, Rabbi Beals. You’re a bit of a mensch yourself.

  8. Sleeping Dog says:

    Will Trump Dump Pence? After Her Tulsa Tryout, Elise Stefanik Could Be The President’s Next VP

    I guess Nicki Haley has fallen from favor. As the writer points out, Tiny is going to soon realize that he needs someone to blame for the admin’s Covid 19 failure and Pence would be the perfect fall guy.

    I wonder how badly dumping Pence will hurt him among evangelicals?

  9. Jen says:

    Since I mentioned the Bubba Wallace incident the other day, I’ll note that the FBI has concluded there was no hate crime committed. The rope found in his garage was apparently a door pull and had been there since at least October 2019.

    In pictures, it certainly appears to be *tied* like a noose. People are now questioning Wallace’s integrity, which is not appropriate.

  10. Sleeping Dog says:

    Biden Ally Chris Coons Cracks Open a Door to Filibuster Reform

    Oh please do it.

    I doubt that the filibuster will go away, it is too useful for senators in the majority who don’t want to vote on an issue, but it is beyond time for reform to happen.

    Some thoughts:
    -Return to the days when the senator(s) filibustering need to hold the floor.
    -Lower the number of votes needed for cloture to 53 or 55.
    -Place a time limit on how long the filibuster can delay a vote.
    -Each time a cloture vote is called, the number of senators voting affirmatively needed to invoke cloture is reduced.

  11. MarkedMan says:

    @Sleeping Dog: The filibuster should be killed. In a world where Republicans vote completely as a block, with only the rare Senator being allowed to vote differently if their seat is at stake and their vote has no effect on the outcome, the filibuster is an anachronism. It might be a wonderful thing in theory, but it has no practical value today’s real world.

    On top of that, does anyone think that a Republican Senator would allow the Dems to filibuster a bill they thought important? They didn’t allow it for Gorsuch or Kavanaugh for “reasons”. Trying to tinker with the filibuster is like the National League trying to tinker with the designated hitter rule, when every time your opponent’s pitcher comes to bat they find “reasons” why they have to go by American League rules just this one time.

  12. OzarkHillbilly says:

    @Sleeping Dog: I wonder how badly dumping Pence will hurt him among evangelicals?

    None at all. They have sold their souls for trump.

  13. MarkedMan says:

    @Sleeping Dog: The article is interesting but I took one look at the picture accompanying it and thought, “Not a chance in hell”. She’s overweight. Trump wouldn’t go with an overweight woman even if he was 6′ tall, 180 lbs and athletic. He certainly won’t given his current physique: 6′ tall in tottering 3″ heels, and 265 pounds packed into a steel boned corset.

    He knows what he would say if it was his opponents that looked like that, “Here come the two fatties!”

  14. OzarkHillbilly says:

    @Jen: “The incident in question occurred in Oct 2019 and was actually a really bad joke on the part of the previous team so no crime at all.”

    Gee, I feel better. Don’t you?

  15. CSK says:

    Trump is getting more and more careless with his application of facial bronzer/orange dye. There was about 3/4 of an inch of pasty white skin on the side of his face between his hairline and the orange mask in a photo taken in Tulsa. It used to be that he’d have to stand in a headwind for that pallid strip to be visible.

  16. Joe says:

    You and I, MarkedMan, have different definitions of overweight. I would observe, however, that, as a Congresswoman from upstate NY, she doesn’t bring much (any) geographic diversity to the table, even if Trump’s change of residence to Florida doesn’t violate Steven’s observation that both candidates cannot be from the same state.

  17. Teve says:

    Stefanik is very cute, her wagon probly won’t hurt her.

  18. Teve says:

    @CSK: Man, I just looked at pictures of that, that dude is in bad shape. If he gets the Rona he’s done for.

  19. Sleeping Dog says:

    Well MLB is returning, if they can keep the players and other personnel healthy. It won’t be a surprise that when a player tests positive, that he and several other players will be exiled to quarantine, destroying a team(s) chances to reach the playoffs.

  20. Jen says:

    @OzarkHillbilly: It’s an odd way to tie a garage door pull, that’s for sure.

  21. Moosebreath says:

    An interesting article at 538 tracing how the Republican Party went all-in on appealing to whites only. From the introduction:

    “The political wisdom is ingrained at this point: Black and brown people don’t vote for Republicans.

    From that principle flows all manner of Republican strategy. Sometimes the efforts are less legalistic and more shock jock — in 2016, the Trump campaign described “suppression efforts” aimed at Black voters, which included placing ads on radio stations popular with African Americans that played up Hillary Clinton’s 1996 comments about “superpredators.” More often, though, these moves by Republicans involve accusations of widespread voter fraud, battles over voter registration, and court challenges to laws meant to protect the franchise of America’s minorities. Talk of “election integrity” by the Grand Old Party is inextricably intertwined with its modern history of pandering to racist elements of American life; any attempt to disentangle these stories and tell them separately is disingenuous, even if it angers partisans.”

  22. CSK says:

    Trump is obviously preparing himself and Cult45 for a loss in November, because he told the audience at his Phoenix rally yesterday that this will be “the most corrupt election in the history of our country.” The Democrats will be “sending ten of millions of ballots using the China virus as the excuse for not allowing people to go to the polls.”

    You can see the way this is going. If Biden wins, it will only be because the election was corrupt, and therefore invalid, so Trump will use that as his rationale for not leaving office. He’ll have to be physically removed if a Biden win is established, will at the very best prove a hideous embarrassment for the U.S.

  23. MarkedMan says:

    @Joe: Oh, she’s not obese, but definitely heavy. And the only heavy woman woman I can think of that Trump has associated himself with publicly in 50 years is HuckaSans. In fact, I suspect Tiffany’s tendency to chunkiness is one of the reasons we never see Trump with her in a place they can be photographed.

  24. senyordave says:

    Michael Flynn walks. How long before they try to give him a prominent role in the administration. So he’s a serial liar about his Russian contacts and was working as an agent for Turkey without disclosing it. That is actually a pretty good resume to work for Trump.

  25. CSK says:

    I read somewhere–it might have been Vanity Fair–that Trump refuses to be photographed with Tiffany because of her weight gain. Some swell father, especially since he himself is repulsively obese and disgustingly flabby.

  26. Teve says:
  27. gVOR08 says:


    People are now questioning Wallace’s integrity

    My understanding is that Wallace didn’t find it, didn’t see it, and didn’t report it. NASCAR, somewhat understandably, overreacted, and the MSM piled on.

    There was also a report of a noose found at Sonoma. As NASCAR isn’t running Sonoma in their truncated season and the “noose” was reported as an old piece of twine in a tree away from the pits, I trust the story will now die.

  28. sam says:
  29. CSK says:

    Thanks. That was it. I believe Madeleine Westerhout. Of course Trump said Tiffany embarrassed him. Why would Westerhout invent that detail?

    Tiffany (an awful name, given her at Trump’s behest) was actually fortunate to have been raised 3000 miles from her father’s foul presence.

  30. Kurtz says:

    I’ve been meaning to post this for the last few days.

    This thread concerns the NY Fed saying that Bitcoin is a fiat currency. This riled up the technoutopians. The linked Twitter thread has a bunch of stuff that implies these guys have no idea what they’re talking about.

    For instance:

    –The OP, in a subsequent tweet, defines “fiat” as “by decree.” This is, in my view, misleading.

    –One guy seems to think giant, heavy limestone wheels called Rai stones were not an example of fiat currency.

    –Bitcoin is a fiat currency by any reasonable definition.

    I’m willing to be proven wrong here.

    Any thoughts?

  31. CSK says:

    Protesters knocked down a statue of Hans Christian Beg, an abolitionist who led a militia that helped slaves escape, and a statue called “Forward,” a feminist allegory of progress and devotion dating from 1895, outside the Wisconsin State House. Beforehand the protesters yelled: “Who’s ready to fuck some shit up?”

    So…”fucking shit up” consisted of pulling down a statue of an abolitionist who died fighting (in the Battle of Chickamauga) to end slavery and the feminist work of a woman sculptor.

    And they think this is going to earn them love and kudos?

  32. Michael Reynolds says:

    Trump is not going to refuse to leave the White House because he would have no backing outside of #Cult45. After Milley’s apology and Mattis’s denunciation the military won’t help him – not that they were ever likely to. The DC police, Park Police, uniformed Secret Service, etc… have no love for him.

    On inauguration day if he won’t leave, security forces, probably the FBI, will enter the WH and remove him on orders from the newly-inaugurated POTUS. The Secret Service won’t stop them. The Army won’t stop them. Cult45 won’t stop them. Even Fox News won’t support him.

    He’s not readying a coup, he’s readying an excuse for losing. It’ll be just another Trump bankruptcy. Nothing is ever his fault, he’s a winner. Tiger blood! He has to remain a legend in his own mind.

    If I were putting money on it I’d say a pre-emptive resignation is about ten times more likely than some Alamo last stand.

  33. Mister Bluster says:

    @Sleeping Dog:..MLB is returning,..

    I was half asleep when I thought I heard that the National League will be using Cub Kid League* rules and designating a hitter along with the American League…

    Say it ain’t so Joe

    *The Cub Kid League was a baseball league formed by my dad and other Cub Scout fathers of
    Pack 113 in Webster NY back in the ’50s. Don’t actually recall the pitching rules but every boy got to play in every game.

  34. CSK says:

    @Michael Reynolds:
    I’ve considered the possibility of Trump resigning pre-emptively and I think it’s quite possible. I also think that he’d resign maybe a week or so before the election, sparing himself the embarrassment of losing and leaving Pence and the Republican party holding the bag. It should be obvious to even the dullest-witted amongst us (but apparently isn’t) that Trump doesn’t give a damn about anything but himself and his reputation as a “winner.”

  35. Sleeping Dog says:


    It is. Though I knew a sales guy how had a noose arranged around a mirror, with the mirror situated in such a manner, that if he turned his head to right he would look into the mirror. Below the mirror, he had a little engraved plaque that said, beat quota or else.

    As a kid, nearly every boy I knew, could tie a noose. It was a useless, if perverse skill that shows up in weird places. Bad taste is timeless.

  36. dazedandconfused says:

    Michael Reynolds,

    It won’t be an Alamo, Davy Crockett had a pair. This guy will leave, whinging mightily as always.

    I put that at ten times more likely than resignation. Narcissists never admit failure. When they wish to leave or give up they are more likely to act more an more outrageously than they are to quit. Getting fired allows indulging in being a victim. Preserves that precious ego.

  37. Kurtz says:

    @Mister Bluster:

    *The Cub Kid League was a baseball league formed by my dad and other Cub Scout fathers of
    Pack 113 in Webster NY back in the ’50s. Don’t actually recall the pitching rules but every boy got to play in every game.

    The Mets should bring Bonilla in so they can get something out of the money they pay him this year.

  38. CSK says:

    But how could Trump possibly deny this big a failure–being rejected by a majority of the American voters in an election? He would, literally, be a loser–the biggest loser, if I may–and worse, a loser to someone he’s painted as a dementia-addled old coot. He would have to face the fact that people found even a senile geriatric preferable to Donald J. Trump.

    When I look at it this way, a resignation shortly before the election seems more and more likely.

  39. Daryl and his brother Darryl says:

    @Michael Reynolds:

    On inauguration day if he won’t leave, security forces, probably the FBI, will enter the WH and remove him on orders from the newly-inaugurated POTUS.

    I have a ton of respect for your opinions…but I respectfully disagree.
    It won’t ever get to inauguration day.
    Do you really think the FBI, part of the DOJ, is going to do anything? Barr will tie this up forever. We have seen that the House is toothless against him. Christ…just today he single-handedly vacated the sentence of an admitted felon, and a traitor to the nation.
    Then, ultimately, Trump v Biden will go to the Justice Boof Court.

    “Our consideration is limited to the present circumstances…”

    Again, who is going to remove Trump? The same people who stopped McConnell from stealing a SCOTUS seat???

    He’s not readying a coup, he’s readying an excuse for losing.

    He’s readying his argument for staying. An argument Barr will take to the mattresses. It’s total nonsense…but so far his total nonsense has been pretty unstoppable.
    For chrissakes…he is literally killing people as we speak, thru his incompetence, and yet nothing happens.

  40. Sleeping Dog says:

    Why are we obsessing about women’s bodies this AM?

  41. Sleeping Dog says:


    There’s a place for him in the administration. Best people and all.

  42. Michael Reynolds says:

    @Daryl and his brother Darryl:
    Thank you, and ditto. But he can’t stay and he won’t. All spending bills originate in the House. Worse comes to worst the House can defund the White House, the DOJ and Homeland Security. It’s also likely we’ll have the Senate. She who holds the purse holds the power.

    Trump has these options:

    1) Accept the election and leave.
    2) Reject the election and leave.
    3) Realize he’ll lose and resign early.
    4) Delude himself into thinking he’ll win, stay, lose, and leave.
    5) Refuse to leave and force the country to drag him away, probably under arrest.

    Rank those in order of humiliation and (5) is by far the worst. It’s also the worst for him financially.

    If I was putting money on it I’d say in order of likelihood:

    A) Stays in the race, loses, leaves.
    B) Resigns early after securing pardons from Pence.
    C) Is dragged off in handcuffs.

    His best option is B. He can claim it’s all rigged, plus he wants Pence to be rewarded for good behavior, blah blah blah, whatever horseshit he needs to shovel to Cult45. He escapes without federal charges, becomes the spiritual leader of a dwindling rebel force, and has a shot at retaining whatever wealth he has left after Putin calls in his loans.

  43. Daryl and his brother Darryl says:

    @Michael Reynolds:
    @Daryl and his brother Darryl:
    Imagine a joint session of Congress, with Pence presiding and McConnell and Barr at his side, certifying Trump’s defeat?
    Not going to happen.

  44. Daryl and his brother Darryl says:

    @Michael Reynolds:

    All spending bills originate in the House. Worse comes to worst the House can defund the White House, the DOJ and Homeland Security.

    C’mon, man. Barr laughs at the House on an almost daily basis. Nadler is a goddamned eunuch.

    It’s also likely we’ll have the Senate.

    Winning the Senate is the only thing that saves the Republic.
    But no pressure…

  45. Sleeping Dog says:

    @Daryl and his brother Darryl:
    @Michael Reynolds:

    Trump and Pence’s term is up at noon, 1/20/2021. Biden will be inaugurated, even if privately by John Roberts. Barr if he hasn’t quit will be fired and Biden will order Tiny removed. The deep state will follow the president’s orders

  46. gVOR08 says:


    I also think that he’d resign maybe a week or so before the election

    I agree that he might resign, although I don’t think the odds are good. And the whole concept of party loyalty would be alien to him. If he does quit, I hope he does it as late as possible, certainly after the convention so as to cause the greatest confusion and embarrassment to the Party and to Pence and/or whoever else might end up on the ticket. I’m also hoping for a late dumping of Pence by Trump.

    Also, commenters above have mentioned Biden staying in his basement. Although he has come out for selected events. Trump’s people seem to be doing what they can to protect him, over his objections to anything visible, but he seems a prime candidate to catch COVID. Odds of any particular individual contacting COVID are pretty low. But his exposure to crowds increases his odds, and he’s old and not very healthy. There’s a non-negligible chance Trump would get a serious case before the election. If he’s incapacitated, all bets are off. I’ve seen speculation he could get a sympathy vote. I suspect the reaction of 80% of the electorate would be closer to mine, bwahahahahahaha.

  47. Daryl and his brother Darryl says:

    @Sleeping Dog:
    Seriously, man…who is going to certify the election?
    Who is going say, yeah, Biden won?
    Pence? McConnell? Barr?

  48. DrDaveT says:

    This animated chart is the best graphic I have yet seen for understanding COVID-19 mortality in the context of more familiar causes of death. (Note that it is now a month out of date.)

  49. Michael Reynolds says:

    @Daryl and his brother Darryl:
    SCOTUS. Congress, including most Republicans. The media. The American people.

    No one at DOJ aside from Barr will work for Trump if they aren’t getting paid, and Nancy holds the purse strings. We can defund the entire Executive Branch and no one gets paid until Trump is gone. Then, if and when he’s gone, he’ll be arrested and can’t be pardoned because Pence will no longer be Veep. If he’s going to avoid arrest he needs a pardon. In order to get a pardon – assuming SCOTUS agrees he can’t pardon himself – he needs to leave before the end.

    Pardon. Resign. Flee. If he decides he’s going to lose it’s his best option.

  50. Sleeping Dog says:

    @Daryl and his brother Darryl:

    The electoral college meets 12/12/20. Biden will be elected and the House will accept it. The current congress house and senate ends 1/2/21 with the new congress sworn in (with a dem senate) 1/3/21. Tiny may chain himself to the Resolute Desk, but the government will not fall in line behind him.

  51. inhumans99 says:

    I already pointed out yesterday that the Republic will be fine post-2020 election…as myself, Sleeping Dog and others have noted if ex-President Trump needs to be marched out of the White House by an armed escort than so be it but I do not think it will get to that.

    A Trump defeat, regardless of whether or not Trump or his hardcore acolytes recognizes this fact, will have quite a few Republicans who are not insane (and believe it or not plenty of them still exist) happy that they no longer need to be “scared” of Trump and will be happy to push Trump out of office and relieved at no longer having to kiss his rear.

    Anyway, I actually came her to point out that while I was watching some youtube stories of the post quake damage in Mexico (which by the way showed a whole lot of folks wearing masks) I also noticed a CNN story about how the U.S. has been sent to the time-out corner and the EU is potentially getting ready to vote on whether or not to deny entrance to U.S. visitors/tourists until we get our act together regarding the pandemic.

    I wanted to laugh and cry and just shake my head in frustration that we are at a point where the EU wants to quarantine the United States because many of the countries that make up the EU have started to get a handle on the pandemic and are not eager to see it flare up again due to U.S. super-spreaders. How far the mighty have fallen indeed…sigh.

    Also, as noted earlier….video from Mexico shows majority wearing masks, contrast that with video of Trump’s AZ rally yesterday, time for another sigh. Youth really do think they are invincible. So glad my college days are behind me, I was not much of party animal in college (if at all) but at least I am no longer surrounded by a bunch of clueless students who could still get folks sick.

    Kinda ironic that students at a college who should be smart enough to know better when it comes to wearing a mask just abandon all caution.

    Do folks call AZ the FL of the West Coast? I say this because on a certain site I go to (well, this one too what with Bill and his FL headline of the day posts) when someone creates a thread involving a crazy story they either say FL or in parentheses note Not Florida, because otherwise everyone just assumes…lol.

  52. CSK says:

    I hoped I’d made it clear that Trump would give absolutely no consideration to party loyalty. How could he? He has none. Nor does he give a damn what befalls the hapless Pence. As long as he can tell himself he’s not a loser, that’s all that matters.

  53. Daryl and his brother Darryl says:

    @Michael Reynolds:
    Great in theory…but you assume a great deal of things that, to date, have shown no indication of being possible.
    Barr has ignored subpoena after subpoena, and held in contempt, with absolutely no consequence. His office is still fully funded and he continues to wreak havoc on the Justice System. Nadler…pffft.
    Senate Republicans refused to even consider removing Trump, even though many of them believed he was guilty as charged.
    SCOTUS? It’s no longer a legitimate institution that can be counted on to decide for Truth over Trump.
    The fuqing media? They will only normalize refusing to leave office. They will “both sides” the issue until the question of whether Trump should leave office, or not, becomes seen as a legitimate question.
    The American people? A good share of whom actively side with the Confederacy?
    And again, even if plausible, none of this can happen until after Congress certifies the Election. That will only be a grotesque display of pig-fuqery.

  54. Scott says:

    @Michael Reynolds:

    No one at DOJ aside from Barr will work for Trump if they aren’t getting paid, and Nancy holds the purse strings.

    This administration have violated so many norms and even Appropriations Law under emergency declarations. There is no physical (as opposed to legal) barriers for the Treasury to pay everyone.

  55. CSK says:

    A Black woman named Winnie Heartstrong, a Republican, who is running for Congress from St. Louis, MO. is promoting a conspiracy theory that George Floyd dies years ago and that the video of his death was faked in order to increase racial tensions.

    I did not make this up.

  56. Mister Bluster says:

    Louie Louie, oh no, me gotta go..

    It’s got a beat and you can dance to it…

  57. wr says:

    @inhumans99: “Do folks call AZ the FL of the West Coast? ”

    There’s gonna have to be a mighty big earthquake before we call Arizona the anything of the West Coast…

  58. gVOR08 says:

    I keep remembering a West Wing episode in which the young black guy who’s the President’s body man asks if he can date the President’s daughter. Bartlett replies that he’s OK with them dating, but adds a fatherly admonition along the lines of, “Remember, the 82nd Airborne works for me.” After noon on Jan 20, if things go as expected, the 82nd Airborne will be working for Joe Biden. I’m not too worried about Trump leaving.

  59. HarvardLaw92 says:

    @Sleeping Dog:

    The real, lasting damage is already done. Trump has been able to get 200 federal judges, as of today – all of them generally young, spry far-righters who’ll occupy those seats for decades – confirmed. It will tilt the federal courts strongly to the right for a generation.

    Politicians come and go, laws are made and unmade. Article III judges are for life …

  60. Sleeping Dog says:


    Yes the damage that Tiny has caused won’t end in January. America will be living with those damages long after I’m dead.

    Saying elections have consequences can sound trite, but it also true and we’ll live with the consequences of 2016 for a long time.

    Trump being gone will only stanch the bleeding. Joe Biden is incapable of healing America, returning it to 2014, 1996 or 1988 won’t accomplish anything. At best Joe can be a palliative, till a more capable leader comes along. Though I’m not optimistic.

    But Trump will be gone and for that result we should be hopeful.

  61. Just nutha ignint cracker says:

    @Daryl and his brother Darryl: Mean spirited comment removed by Cracker.

  62. Just Another Ex-Republican says:

    A question for the legal experts here. I know Dems have talked about packing the Supreme Court to get past McConnell’s evil, but I don’t think that is a winning issue politically. However, to the best of my knowledge it’s entirely up to Congress how many districts and circuits and appellate courts we have, how many judges are on each, and what the boundaries are. The right has wanted to break up the 9th Circuit for bogus BS reasons for years, but I think it is time to rethink them. Throw the right a bone-fine! Break up the 9th! And God knows our legal system is clogged with cases and ridiculous backlogs and delays anyway, so there’s a perfectly legit argument for saying we need more judges. So in addition maybe we should create a few more districts and circuit courts? Then all the geographical boundaries have to be reset, and gosh, that means existing judges need to be re-arranged too…

    Is there any reason a Democratic party in charge of the Presidency and both houses of Congress (trying to be optimistic here) couldn’t do the above?

  63. Gustopher says:

    We have a Trump appointee on a court of appeals ruling that charges against Flynn must be dropped, while the House is hearing testimony about inappropriate political influence on the Flynn prosecutors.

    Do we even have a pretense of rule of law?

  64. MarkedMan says:

    @gVOR08: As someone who grew up when half the long running shows on television were westerns, and the Oscar winning movies that had made it to TV were westerns, and who was therefore inundated with noose iconography, I admit that all this searching for nooses makes me uncomfortable. Heck, in NYC the media crucified some woman older than me who had decorated her yard with the gravestones of my youth as well as a noose hanging from a tree. When I was a kid Halloween was cobwebs, “wild Wild West” gravestones, and a noose hanging from a tree branch. At least outside the south it had nothing to do with the Klan lynchings.

  65. MarkedMan says:


    Any thoughts?

    Bit coin is to libertarians what crystals are to 60 year old hippies?

  66. MarkedMan says:

    @Michael Reynolds:

    He’s not readying a coup, he’s readying an excuse for losing.

    This. Trump’s modus operandi for 40 years: Step 1) Promise the world; Step 3) Storming off while blaming everyone he partnered with.

    Note there is no Step 2) Doing the work

  67. MarkedMan says:


    There’s a non-negligible chance Trump would get a serious case before the election.

    There’s a part of me that thinks somewhere in that animalistic Trump brain, he is actually trying to get C19. That would be his out.

  68. gVOR08 says:

    @Kurtz: AFAIK no one makes jewelry out of bitcoin. And it’s useless for plating electrical contacts or for heat shields. Does bitcoin have any value for any purpose except exchange? If not it’s hard to see how it’s a “currency” except by fiat, even if the fiat is some sort of mutual agreement.

  69. Tyrell says:

    “Senate wants government to release UFO files to public” (Politico)
    Senate committee could require government, including military, to release ufo documents.
    “UFO balloon over Japan sets Twitter afire” (NYT)
    “Three blue fireballs light up sky over Puerto Rico” (Daily Express)

    What we have been waiting for is here, and as UFO sightings are increasing. We are finally at a point where the main stream news can no longer continue to ignore what is happening.

  70. Michael Cain says:

    Request for post… Which is more likely if the Democrats get a trifecta (oval office and both houses)? The nuclear option being used to wipe out the filibuster for legislation generally? Or the nuclear option used a number of times to establish precedents that “cloture doesn’t apply to voting rights” or “cloture doesn’t apply to minimum wage”?

  71. Moosebreath says:

    @Michael Cain:

    “The nuclear option being used to wipe out the filibuster for legislation generally? Or the nuclear option used a number of times to establish precedents that “cloture doesn’t apply to voting rights” or “cloture doesn’t apply to minimum wage”?”

    I am not sure there would be any practical long term difference between them. If the nuclear option is used to create holes in the filibuster by one side, the other side will use that as precedent to create similar holes for what they want to pass, continuing until there is effectively no filibuster remaining.

  72. Mister Bluster says:


    UNIDENTIFIED Flying Object…
    Let us know when one lands on your roof Ty so you can identify it for us.

  73. An Interested Party says:

    He’ll have to be physically removed if a Biden win is established, will at the very best prove a hideous embarrassment for the U.S.

    He’s already been a hideous embarrassment for the U.S., what a little more of the same?

    He would, literally, be a loser–the biggest loser, if I may–and worse, a loser to someone he’s painted as a dementia-addled old coot.

    Once Biden has won, he should look straight at the cameras and tell Trump that he’s fired…

  74. Moosebreath says:

    @Mister Bluster:

    “Let us know when one lands on your roof Ty so you can identify it for us.”

    To steal a line from Spider Robinson, when that happens, @Tyrell: will be a UGO (Unidentified Goggling Object).

  75. Gustopher says:


    What we have been waiting for is here, and as UFO sightings are increasing. We are finally at a point where the main stream news can no longer continue to ignore what is happening.

    It really is a shame that people are becoming less and less educated about flying objects and are having problems identifying them.

  76. MarkedMan says:


    If the nuclear option is used to create holes in the filibuster by one side,

    Why is that in the future tense? The Republicans have already done this.

  77. Tyrell says:

    @Sleeping Dog: Finally, but July 23 is still too far away. Now time for the NBA to get its act going. We need the professional and college sports.
    WWE scarcely skipped a beat, and its premier event, Wrestlemania, was even better with a two night format. Undertaker literally buried his opponent in a real hole in a ground! Then the amazing “Money in the Bank” event that had matches on McMahon’s WWE offices.
    NASCAR has also not sat around.
    On August 24, Roger Penske finally gets the Indy 500 on, with fans in attendance. An event that should have been held when it was supposed to be: Memorial Day Sunday.
    Crank it up!

  78. DrDaveT says:


    We need the professional and college sports.

    As big a sports junkie as I am, I have to say that “the professional and college sports” are probably somewhere around 95,273rd on the list of things “we need” at the moment. If they vanished forever, it would be a minor annoyance. It might even be a net positive, if minority students stopped putting all of their eggs in that leaky basket and universities suddenly remembered why they really exist.

  79. Jax says:

    What we have here, folks, is the perfect specimen of red-blooded, older, conservative male homo sapien in his natural form. If them gawt-damn mindlessly entertainin sports aren’t on during a pandemic, they start on conspiracy theories about UFO’s. The zookeeper’s have learned to shut the internet off during certain times of day during visitor hours in order to maximize visitor enjoyment of the temper tantrums when the teevee and internet is out.

    Crank it up!

  80. wr says:

    @Tyrell: “Now time for the NBA to get its act going. We need the professional and college sports.”

    Tyrell is right. People should be forced to risk their health and their lives so that Tyrell doesn’t have to find new ways to keep himself entertained. What are a few dozen agonizing deaths compared to the hole in Tyrell’s viewing schedule?

  81. Moosebreath says:


    “Why is that in the future tense? The Republicans have already done this.”

    Which ones are you thinking of? Removing the filibuster for judicial confirmations was first done by Democrats (though threatened first by Republicans).