Tuesday’s Forum
Steven L. Taylor
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Tuesday, June 20, 2023
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39 comments
About Steven L. Taylor
Steven L. Taylor is a Professor of Political Science and a College of Arts and Sciences Dean. His main areas of expertise include parties, elections, and the institutional design of democracies. His most recent book is the co-authored
A Different Democracy: American Government in a 31-Country Perspective. He earned his Ph.D. from the University of Texas and his BA from the University of California, Irvine. He has been blogging since 2003 (originally at the now defunct Poliblog).
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At least 38 people shot, including two fatally, at weekend in US
The STL shooting left this litany of death and mayhem: 1 dead and
Can’t you just feel the freedom?
Memo to my wife- As we leave the White House, don’t pack my shorts and Strat-O-Matic baseball things in the same box with the nuclear attack plans for China.
Trump offers dizzying new justifications for classified documents as former Cabinet secretaries sound the alarm
Former President Donald Trump offered a dizzying multitude of new justifications Monday for keeping classified material after leaving the White House and refusing to give them back to the National Archives and Records Administration.
“I was very busy,” he told Fox News’ Bret Baier, explaining that he wanted to go through all the boxes identified by the Archives to remove personal things before handing them over.
Trump said he wanted to pull out “all sorts of things, golf shirts, clothing, pants, shoes,” interspersed with papers in his boxes.
@Bill Jempty:
And some question Biden’s mental acuity.
I’m really hoping that trump demands taking the stand in his own defense. Even if there are no cameras in the courtroom the transcripts alone will provide great entertainment.
It is anticipated that one or more TV networks are going to petition the court to allow cameras during the trial. The conventional wisdom, is that the defense will oppose that motion. But I wonder, trump’s ego is so large and he believes that he is such a master of communication, he may actually believe would be to his benefit for the trial to be broadcast. It would really be gripping TV, on par with the OJ trial and Watergate hearings.
@Bill Jempty: Linky no workee.
@Bill Jempty:
I now think this will end up in a plea bargain.
Trump just confessed on live TV.
Does anyone think Jack Smith won’t play that for the jury.
Christ, the entire first part of the indictment was Smith quoting Trumps own words.
This trial is over before it even began.
A hard read: Days of desperation: the diary of a woman forced to flee Texas for an abortion
The whole should be read, it’s not long.
@Bill Jempty:
One of the Cheeto’s many problems, is that almost always he tries to justify his actions when accused of wrongdoing. He either doesn’t care or doesn’t know he’s admitting to wrongdoing this way.
Of course, he later usually changes his tune. Most often he’ll deny wrongdoing after justifying it. Then he will claim it wasn’t wrong anyway, then add subtract, mix up, etc. until there’s a mess of contradictory “defenses” no sane being could ever even want to make sense of.
This may work in the proverbial court of public opinion, and certainly among his deplorables, enablers, and hangers-on. But the real courts of law tend to cut into questions of fact, including the parts where he admits to committing crimes.
Some casual research on the all-important pudding matter, point to 1) using less milk, and 2) folding in things like whipped cream.
I may try something like that, as soon as I figure out how to get sugar free whipped cream. Some seems to be available commercially. Another option is to make my own. There are several brands of liquid heavy cream for whipping. What I lack is an adequate mixer.
@Bill Jempty:
@OzarkHillbilly:
ETA all I can say, channeling Bugs Bunny, is “what a maroon!”
https://www.cnn.com/2023/06/20/politics/trump-indictment-cabinet-secretaries-what-matters/index.html
@Flat Earth Luddite: Thanx.
@Bill Jempty: @Flat Earth Luddite: From that CNN piece:
Interesting? I what way? He’s a weasel behaving as a weasel does. It’s just SSDD.
@Bill Jempty: The amount of “dizzying justifications” come from all directions:
From Justifying Trump to Justifying Autocracy
I’d forgotten how miserable S. Florida can be on with 90 degree temperatures the day after torrential thunderstorms have soaked every square inch for 90 miles. It’s 12:45pm local time and I’ve taken two showers already.
Can’t wait to get back to L.A.
@EddieInCA:
Florida…it’s like 1930’s Germany, only humid.
@EddieInCA: Florida keeps me humble. I’ve been there 10-20 times on business and once for pleasure (tacking a family vacation onto the end of a business trip) and if I was operating in a vacuum I would say, “This place is a disaster. 8 months of the year no one would even want to visit, let alone live there. And those remaining 4 months would be spent in one of the skeeviest locations in the US.” Yet I know so many people who love visiting and who have retired there or are looking forward to retiring there. My take on how people perceive it is so very, very wrong.
The only thing that comes close is Scandinavian Death Metal. It astounds me that even young punks like it, but I once walked into a Stockholm bar full of middle aged people to find it playing obnoxiously loud. In fairness, I was later told it was nowhere near as loud as it would be played in a nightclub.
@Daryl:
Yes, but a plea bargain is an admission of guilt, which in fact Trump’s’s done already by demanding that the other Republican candidates to sign a pledge to pardon him, but he may not know that. But surely, surely his lawyers have explained to him about what’s involved in taking a plea.
Do you think Trump would consciously admit guilt?
@CSK: I think a time will come when his outrage over someone getting something HE wasn’t offered will overcome his other impulses. It’s not like he’s not already a living breathing contradiction.
ETA: On the other hand I am a little curious about why he’s not CLAIMING to have gotten an even better deal, which he refused because he’s not guilty of anything.
The Georgia Secretary of State has closed it’s investigation into Election fraud and the counting of ballots at State Farm Arena. Spoiler alert; the investigation did not uncover any violations.
https://sos.ga.gov/sites/default/files/2023-06/SEB2020-059%20ROI%20redacted.pdf
Colludy Rudy is currently being sued by Ruby Freeman for defamation. No doubt this will help her case.
Tick Tock
https://twitter.com/daveweigel/status/1671188224260096000
First poll showing real slippage bc of indictment — favorable rating among GOP voters down from 77% to 67%, outside margin of error.
Still up 21 points on DeSantis, but non-Trump vote slightly bigger than Trump vote (47%).
https://www.cnn.com/2023/06/20/politics/cnn-poll-trump-indictment-republicans-2024/index.html
@CSK:
“…but a plea bargain is an admission of guilt…”
Sure…but remember what he said about taking the Fifth?
He then reportedly took the Fifth over 400 times during a deposition.
If you are looking for consistency from him you are wasting your time.
@charontwo:
https://twitter.com/aedwardslevy/status/1671192359634186250
https://s3.documentcloud.org/documents/23854152/cnn-poll-on-trump-after-2nd-indictment.pdf
@Daryl:
Yes, but he defended his pleading the Fifth by saying that his lawyers had explained to him the necessity of so doing. I know he’s inconsistent, but admitting guilt may be a bridge too far for him.
@just nutha:
Actually, I can well envision Trump saying that he was offered a great–many people are saying the best–deal, but turned it down because he’s innocent.
@Flat Earth Luddite:
Bugs Bunny: definitely the most under-rated political philosopher of the modern era.
@Kathy: If you get your hands on an egg beater you should have no problem. You can even whip cream with a whisk if you absolutely have to, although it will take time and is quite annoying. (just get the heaviest cream you can. Light cream can usually be whipped into whipped cream but can collapse on you.)
I have a simple mechanical eggbeater which I have used to make anything from omelettes to cream cheese pie.
@JohnSF:
What? No daily reminder of Boris and his travails? 😀
You will all be disappointed to hear, no doubt, that England lost the first test of the Ashes series.
England 393-8 declared (Root 118 not out; Lyon 4-149) & 273 (Root 46, Brook 46; Cummins 4-63, Lyon 4-80)
Australia 386 (Khawaja 141, Broad 3-68, Robinson 3-55) & 282-8 (Khawaja 65, Cummins 44 not out)
Australia won by two wickets.
Pity we lost, but it was damn close.
And IMO (and of others) one of the classic Ashes tests of all time. One for the ages.
Bring on #2 at Lords, June 28th!
@JohnSF: Wow! And they were so far out in front at the end of the first day. I really don’t get this game at all–though it was fun to watch when I was in NI in 69.
@CSK:
Taking a day off, so that I may savour the sweetness still more when I return to the subject.
😉
Just please, lets have you guys do the same for your incubus.
Pleasing me: polling among Conservative voters (as opposed to Party members) shows they think Johnson was a poor PM. and a lying sod.
The Tory party membership may be boarding the crazy train to Crazy Town, but even Conservative inclined voters aren’t signing up for the ride.
Latest polling from Redfield & Wilton:
Lab: 46% (+2)
Con: 26% (-4)
LibDem: 12% (-1)
Reform (= UKIP, basically): 7% (+1)
Green: 6% (+2)
INJECT ME!
🙂
@JohnSF:
If by incubus you mean Trump, I’m sorry, but I can’t stop trashing him and relishing–nay, savoring–his defeats.
@Just nutha ignint cracker:
Team captain Ben Stokes took a bit of a gamble declaring at 393 rather than going for max runs, which would prob have ensured at least a draw. It’s his way, and England team these days: go for the win, even if it’s risky.
Problem was, the pitch was not doing much for the bowling attack.
And Aussie batsman Khawaja was utterly brilliant. In for most of the day, scored 144.
They couldn’t quite catch the England lead, but when England only got 273 in the second innings (I say only but 273 isn’t bad really), Australia were within chasing distance.
And the Aussies are a determined bunch.
Two very, very good sides fighting hard.
@CSK:
Well, if you has another incubus, can’t think who it might be. 😉
(RFK Jr seems more like a laughibus, at present.)
But you need to stake that particular undead.
Then burn down his castle.
Polling from the US looks rather less locked in than UK indicators.
@JohnSF:
Truly a Renaissance rabbit. Philosopher, barber, athlete, and one of the greatest operatic divas to ever ride a white horse down a mountain.
@JohnSF: I must not understand UK politics very well. I was under the impression that his being a lying sod didn’t bother them until the lies became too transparent for anyone other that the most gullible and stubit (a pronunciation from my Northern Irish forbearers) to believe them.
@Just nutha ignint cracker:
“… being a lying sod didn’t bother them…”
Thing is being a liar as a politician is one thing.
Lying to the House is another, very different thing.
The UK parliamentary system requires that members recruited to the executive MUST NOT lie to the House. It cannot function otherwise.
I am not so naive as to to hope for perfect honesty from politicians.
Deliberate deception of the Commons is something else entirely.
“It cannot be borne.”
The Commons is part of the Court of Westminster; in effect all ministerial statements are under oath. But OTOH only the Commons may judge it’s own members behaviour, and its codes of practice.
It’s a very different system to the US separation of powers.
@JohnSF:
It’s sort of a Brit thing: MP’s can be (and have been) suspended for saying a minister is lying.
Precisely because a minister MUST NOT lie.
The presumption of honesty within the the House is vital to the UK system.
You can be artful, or dodge things, or shade it: but outright dishonesty to the Commons cannot and must not be tolerated.
@grumpy realist:
I’m kind of mixer deficient. I’ve a hand mixer capable of one speed. I tried it to do whipped cream years ago, and came nowhere close. It does better with things like egg whites, cream cheese, butter.
But I did find the no sugar added whipped cream at Walmart.
@JohnSF:
I don’t claim to know much about Boris’ tenure. From what I know, he did two things right:
1) improved the response to COVID after he nearly died from it. Not enough, but “not enough” was more of a global condition.
2) He solidly backed Ukraine.
@Kathy:
There’s some debate over exactly how ill he was. From “at death’s door” to “a mild case, and he was frivolous about it.” The inkscreen of competing narratives is obscuring a lot at the moment.
re. Ukraine: sort of inclined to give him that.
But the key thing is Operation ORBITAL (the UK military assistance for Ukraine) had been in place since 2015.
SecDef Wallace had made it pretty clear any reversal of ORBITAL would be a resignation issue.
And in UK politics you cannot underestimate the role of the “establishment”: the collective opinions of the Privy Council, the Chiefs of Staff, the “active Lords”, the Palace, the Security Council, the Commons committees, etc.
But also, to give BoJo a bit of credit(?): at base, he too is a child and product of the Establishment (whereas Trump is an outsider).
He likely has some grasp of the basic interests of Britain, and at least a residual loyalty to the national interest, so long as it does not interfere with his personal interest.