House Republicans Are Dooming Their 2016 Nominee With Latino Voters
Republicans in the House seem determined to make life difficult for whomever wins the GOP nomination in 2016
Jonathan Chait argues that House Republicans seem to be acting as if they want whomever happens to win the Republican nomination in 2016 to lose the election:
Viewed from the standpoint of a year or even six months ago, Friday night’s House vote to deport some half-million immigrants who arrived illegally in the United States as children would have been unthinkable. After the 2012 election, an official Republican postmortem urged the party to embrace comprehensive immigration reform. Republicans in both chambers followed through on this advice. No less orthodox a figure than Paul Ryan toured around Chicago with Democrat Luis Gutierrez, where he was greeted enthusiastically by a mariachi band.
Comprehensive immigration reform has suffered a slow, painful death for months on end. For a while, it seemed Republicans might instead try to force Democrats to accept the quarter-of-a-loaf compromise of a Dream Act, which would legalize illegal immigrants brought to the United States as children (and, thus, personally blameless). Even that gambit foundered. The worst-case scenario then seemed to be that Republicans would do nothing at all to address the broken immigration system or the gulf of mistrust among Latino and Asian voters.
Now they have settled upon a course of action even worse than the worst-case scenario. The cause, of course, is the child-migrant crisis, which is driven by a combination of a badly written 2008 law and endemic violence in Central America, but which Republicans blame instead on President Obama’s granting of temporary amnesty to some Dream Act-eligible immigrants. When House conservatives revolted against a border security measure, the party leadership mollified them by holding a vote to nullify Obama’s dispensation for the Dreamers.
(…)
A party that began the Congressional term hoping to move left from Mitt Romney’s immigration stance has instead moved toward Michele Bachmann’s. (Bachmann — who, along with Steve King, helped draft the House bill — pronounces herself thrilled.) The party’s new dogma will potentially entangle its next nominee in an even less humane debate than the one that ensnared Romney. At the very least, it has put 216 House Republicans, many of whom will one day seek higher office, on record for a policy most Latino voters consider disqualifying. The aye votes include potential 2016 presidential candidate Paul Ryan, who is not likely to be greeted by friendly mariachi bands any time soon.
Scott Bland and Alex Roarty at National Journal make a similar observation:
House Republicans’ bill to undo one of President Obama’s immigrant-protection programs will never become law. But it could still cause the GOP trouble in the next presidential election. To understand why, just look at how Rep. Cory Gardner voted on Friday night.
Faced with a similar vote in 2013, the Colorado Republican stuck with his party and voted to end the program. But this time, facing a tough Senate campaign in the one 2014 battleground state that most epitomizes a rapidly diversifying America, Gardner split from party leaders to oppose the GOP effort to kill the immigration program.
Gardner, who represents a safe Republican district, has modified several positions over the past year to better position himself to win statewide in Colorado, the tipping-point state in the last two presidential elections. He appears to be following the playbook most Republican political thinkers prescribe if the party hopes to attract the new voters necessary to retake the White House after a crushing disappointment in 2012.
But, as Friday’s House vote on the Deferred Action for Childhood Arrivals (DACA) program demonstrated, most Republicans aren’t making similar changes to their immigration positions. And consequently, it’s unlikely the next GOP presidential nominee, put through the rigors of a hyper-competitive primary controlled largely by conservative activists, will have the same flexibility, given opposition to DACA is now thoroughly woven into orthodoxy. The party’s standard-bearer, in effect, will have to try to win Colorado after taking policy positions the state’s current GOP Senate nominee plainly thinks would hurt his chances at victory.
“Short-term, this is a lot tougher for Democrats than for us,” said Republican pollster Wes Anderson, referencing polls showing immigration hurting Democratic incumbents across the country in 2014. “Long-term? I think Sen. [Marco] Rubio’s experience with the issue has taught most Republicans to tread very lightly into these waters.”
(…)
What happened Friday night is, in many ways, representative of how congressional Republicans have hurt their party’s attempts to win back the White House in 2016.
After the 2012 elections, Republicans declared with great urgency that the party must broaden its appeal to women and racial minorities or face near-permanent exclusion from the White House. But in the 21 months since that election, GOP lawmakers have gone the other way, whittling away at their party’s appeal among the voters a Republican candidate would need to take the White House.
“There are a number of things Republicans can do to be more open to courting Hispanics and courting women voters,” said Glen Bolger, a Republican strategist. “The question is, does the party have the willpower to do it? So far since 2012, the answer would have to be no.”
This isn’t a new story, of course. Republican have gone fairly far downhill since 2004 when George W. Bush got 44% of the Latino vote after getting 38% of that vote in 2000. Four years later, John McCain saw that number drop to 35%, which was lower than Bush had garnered but still somewhat respectable. By 2012, though, the number had dropped even further as Mitt Romney received just 27% of the Latino vote, nearly 20 percentage points fewer than a Republican nominee had received just eight years earlier. It’s not too hard to figure out what happened during that time period. George Bush’s last term saw a large segment of his own party revolt against him in the effort to put together a comprehensive immigration reform package with the help of Senators such as Ted Kennedy, John McCain, and Lindsey Graham. To some degree, McCain’s support for immigration reform, which nearly cost him the nomination in 2008, was the reason that he still managed to maintain a respectable level of support among Latino voters.
After McCain, though, and especially more recently, the Republican Party has adopted policy positions that are clearly not helping them with Latino voters. On the broadest level, of course, the party’s inability to pass anything resembling immigration reform in the House stands as a pretty strong demonstration of where the party stands on something that Latino voters strongly support. More recently, the public statements that have come from Republicans regarding the Central American migrants that have arrived at the southern border over the past year or so, as well as the recent moves to try to repeal DACA which will go nowhere but are clearly intended mostly to just placate a Republican base that has become increasingly anti-immigrant, will no doubt only further serve to alienate Latino voters from the Republican Party. As it did in 2012, that will cause problems for whichever candidate wins the nomination in 2016 in states such as Florida, Colorado, New Mexico, and Virginia, and it will make it much harder for a Republican nominee to win in any of the other states that President Obama did in 2012, which they will have to do if they are going to get to 270 votes in the Electoral College.
If the actions of the House Republicans are any indication, it will be next to impossible for a candidate to win the Republican nomination in 2016 without taking an even harder line position than Mitt Romney did in the 2012, when he made a name for himself by attacking Rick Perry for things such as supporting in-state tuition for children of illegal immigrants and suggesting that people here illegally should “self-deport” rather than expect to obtain any kind of legal status. Perhaps the best signal of that is the fact that someone such as Jeb Bush, who has been calling on his party to moderate its positions on immigration for years, has already been written off by most conservatives. Even Marco Rubio, who was a darling of the Tea Party in 2010 when he took on then Florida Governor Charlie Crist for the Senate nomination has seen his stock among the Tea Party crowd decline significantly ever since he supported the Senate’s comprehensive immigration reform bill. With those two examples in front of them, along with the strong pressure that the base has applied toward Congress on issues such as immigration reform and DACA, does anyone actually think that a candidate for the GOP nomination in 2016 is going to even try to hint that they might be supportive of anything other than “border security” when it comes to immigration form?
Of course not. If anything, the Republican nominee will most likely be even more more strongly opposed to immigration reform, and therefore even more of a turn off for Latino voters, than Mitt Romney was. Exactly how that is supposed to be the key to electoral success is beyond me.
Short term, helps them in red states in 2014 elections, though. If they win the Senate, they prevent Obama from making more nominations, especially court nominations, and maybe they get to do their Tea Party dream-IMPEACH!
It only helps them short term if voting participation patterns hold. If pro-immigration people manage to get the Hispanic vote out disproportionally it might backfire.
See, how many times does that 44% number have to be debunked. The Republicans range between 20% and 35% of the Latino vote. The idea that the Republicans should throw middle class white voters under the bus to pander to Latinos is laughable. If Republicans move to the left enough to get a significant portion of the Latino vote, then a huge number of white voters will stay home. Becoming the Democratic-lite Party by supporting open borders, amnesty, and cheap labor is not a true path for survival for any form of conservative party in the U.S. Unlike,the OWS types, conservatives will try to actually change things at the ballot box and vote the cheap labor types out of office.
Every establishment Republican like Jeb Bush or Marco Rubio should be able to stand in front of a crowd of middle class, private sectored employed whites and explain why their proposal for immigration are a good deal for the people in that crowd. That none of the establishment Republicans can do that but just resort to screaming racist and bigot shows how weak the arguments are for comprehensive immigration reform.
Tea Party faithful do not want Latino votes. It’s a good bet that they do not want black votes either.
They are so deluded that they think they can get enough white voters to support their mindless agenda.
You know “Keep the Government’s hand off my Medicare.”
This is pretty much a baseline from which we can measure their intelligence…or lack thereof.
@superdestroyer:
Maybe Republicans can do a better job of explaining why it is that they view all Hispanic and Latino voters, as illegal? These people are, after all, American citizens. Is it that “they all look alike”? Is it that they cannot distinguish Hispanic and Latino voters from the refugees at our border? What is it?
I find it hilarious that people screaming the loudest about immigration this time around a.k.a. Pat Buchanan are descended from the same immigrants other Americans were screaming about 150 years ago.
“No Irish need apply.” Remember that?
And if English gets paralleled with Spanish and we all need to become bilingual, so much the better for all of us since being multilingual helps to improve brain connections and protect one against the ravages of Alzheimer’s. (Plus I can’t think of an easier language to learn than Spanish.)
@Mu: That the Latino vote could sink the candidacy of a Republican who seemingly has it in the bag isn’t just hypothetical. It has happened before:
http://fivethirtyeight.blogs.nytimes.com/2010/11/03/did-polls-underestimate-democrats-latino-vote/
@superdestroyer: “The idea that the Republicans should throw middle class white voters under the bus to pander to Latinos is laughable”
You see, the difference between a racist and a non-racist is that the latter does not see the needs of Latinos and whites as necessarily in conflict. So next time someone calls you a racist, you’ll understand. You’re welcome!
@al-Ameda:
You did not answer the question. How is comprehensive immigration reform a good deal for those middle class white who actually do vote for Republicans. How is adding more people who are eligible for quotas ans set asides a good deal. How is adding more people where English is a second language a good deal. How is adding more people to the entitlement roles a good deal? Who is increasing an demographic group where more than 50% of the children are born to single mothers a good eal?
Will the newly legalized immigration pay enough in taxes to offset all of the governmental costs? What is the basis to say that the children of all of those illegal aliens will be the entrepreneurs and engineers of the future as so many progressives have claimed?
It’s all just a matter of messaging.
Republicans only need explain that deporting every single Dreamer is good for them…like Paul Ryan cutting programs that benefit poor people is actually good for poor people…then they will vote for Republicans in droves.
Which will happen right after tax cuts for the rich and government spending cuts create massive economic growth.
Here again, we see the myth being spread that the only way the GOP wins elections is amnesty.
Myth it is.
The fact is, that it is the death blow for the GOP.
Think on this… why didn’t Obama push this agenda when he had both houses under Dem control?
Because he wanted to blame the very unpopular amnesty agenda, on the GOP.
And of course, there are plenty of RINOs willing to do Obamas bidding on the matter.
@wr:
If one group is eligible for ethnic quotas, set asides, and affirmative action, and the other group is not, then the two groups are not the same. Look at the demographic data for the two and you will quickly conclude they are not the same. However, what progressives care the most about is that all of those newly legalized Latinos will eventually become automatic Democratic voters, will turn the U.S. into a one party state, and will increase the size and scope of the federal government. All of those are wins for Democrats.
@superdestroyer:
Immigration creates economic growth. Economic growth is good for everyone.
Don’t believe me…search the topic at any site that isn’t some right wing nut job site.
You are a raging xenophobe…so you are intellectually unable to accept facts. It is impossible to reason with someone who does not come to their opinions through reason.
So this is pointless.
It’s okay. No matter how many minorities vote against the GOP candidate, he will win in a landslide as long as he is a TRUE CONSERVATIVE (TM)
@superdestroyer:
How is bashing other people’s English skills so hilariously ironic when it comes from someone who does not seem to know that a question ends with a question mark rather than a period.
@Eric Florack:
Think on this… why didn’t Obama push this agenda when he had both houses under Dem control?
Because he wanted to blame the very unpopular amnesty agenda, on the GOP.
And of course, there are plenty of RINOs willing to do Obamas bidding on the matter.
So Obama is the evil genius with mind control powers today. Tomorrow he’ll be the incompetent buffoon.
@superdestroyer:
I hardly know how to respond to somebody who says
“How is adding more people where English is a second language a good deal.”
Do I ask if all your ancestors spoke English when they arrived here?
Do I suggest that America would be a better place in all sorts of ways if everybody spoke a second language? –as is the norm in most of the world. Countless studies prove this to be a Good Thing for cognitive development, which is why nearly all upper-class American parents insist on it for their kids. But heaven forbid that your normal common-sense Americans should be subjected to such things. Indeed let us ban people who threaten to be bilingual!!
Do I mention that my grandfather spoke six languages when he arrived from Poland via Denmark and none of them was English? Sheesh.
Honestly, the statement is just so ignorant and so xenophobic, and it kind of stuns me to realize how many Americans would agree with you.
@ElizaJane:
“Do I ask if all your ancestors spoke English when they arrived here?”
I will add that Pennsylvania had laws in the early years of the 20th century requiring that in communities where at least 10% of the population spoke German or Italian, all legal notices be published in that language. It’s amazing how people are blind to their own history.
@Eric Florack:
Gee…let me think on that.
Oh…wait…maybe because for the short time he had a Democratic Congress…and it was never, ever, filibuster proof…he was dealing with the greatest economic crisis since the great depression, two unfinished wars, and OBL still on the run…thanks to his Republican predecessor.
Once he manged to get those Republican f’ups under control…and provide 20 million people with insurance…then he had time to focus on immigration.
I guess, by definition, bigots are stupid. So that explains you.
@mantis: Your comment would be a good point, but for one thing… blaming others is an instinctive reaction for liberals in general, and of late, Obama in particular. It requires no thought at all.
@grumpy realist: I can’t tell you how many times in the last few months I’ve been reminded of the line from Blazing Saddles, “We’ll take take the n*****s and the ch***s, but no Irish!” I wonder if Buchanan ever saw the movie.
@superdestroyer: It’s a good deal and if only because those latino immigrants actually will have kids who work and will pay the social security and medicare for those middle class whites 30 years down the road when whites will be the demographic minority of the workforce.
@gVOR08: I remember as a child having a dream where the US had turned into a society where scientists had to go around in hiding and knowledge of a foreign language meant that one was treasonous.
Little did I know my predictive powers…
Again, people like SD and Florack are China’s biggest weapon against the US. I hope they realize that.
@ElizaJane:
I want to know what English-Firsters are so afraid of – that they have to see signs in multiple languages? Or, god forbid, they have to learn something in order to communicate with others? Speaking more than one language is not a detriment, but rather a useful life skill in a world with dozens of languages to do business in. I use to recommend as an adviser that all my students take at least one other language even if it wasn’t required – more if they planned on a MBA. No matter how old they are, I’ve always recommended brushing up on existing skills and seeing if you can pick up some more – you never know when it will come in handy or when the next deal is make or break because you’ve got that little inside edge.
But if you’re not bright, if languages confuse you, it must seem terrifying to have to learn a new skill late in life. They don’t want to learn because they can’t. All of a sudden, here’s a threat to daily life they never anticipated – trying to communicate a basic thought and being forcibly reminded the world is a hell of a lot larger then Smallville USA.
@C. Clavin:
You make a great argument of why Sheldon Adelson and the Koch Brothers support open borders and the free movement of people across borders. However, I doubt if the economic growth created by the poor of the third world is going to off set all of the increased costs of the middle class. If they have to move, put their children in private schools, pay higher taxes, or pay higher insurance premiums due to increased immigration from third world countries, then it does nothing for them economically. When people need Masters Degrees to work at Starbucks, the economic need or cheap labor is massively overstated.
@ElizaJane:
Considering how few of the immigrants are literate in their first language, how does adding millions of people who will need to read and write in their native tongue in addition to English help the situation. Also, if education dollars have to be shifted to ESL, remedial training, and special education, then do really think that the schools will have the money so that all of the American residents can learn formal Spanish?
@Mu:
Once again the Jeb Bush Argument: White Americans are too lazy to do manual labor, too stupid to do high-tech work, too defective to get married, and too self-centered to have children. Do you really think that a demographic group where more than 50% of the children are born to unwed mothers, where a large percentage never finish high school, and where the second and third generations are worse off financially than the first generation is really going to pay enough taxes to fund all of the entitlements that progressive want? If having a large number of Latino immigrants meant financial well-being for a government, then California would be running massive budget surpluses and the unemployment rate in California would be well below the national average. Since neither of those has occurred in decades, I fail to see real world examples of how great open borders is for government finances.
Spics are so much trouble.
@KM:
The difference is choosing to learn another language versus being forced to learn another language in order to have a job in the U.S. Look at the recent push to bring back bilingual education in California. One of the agendas in the push is to create more teacher jobs that Latinos will be qualified to take while eliminating jobs for non-Spanish speaker.
Why should Americans be forced to learn another language because our political leaders like open borders, unlimited immigration, and the free movement of people across borders.
Also, I liked the snark that Americans, are, once again, too stupid to do something and must be replaced. I am sure that the room full of middle class whites really want to hear why they must learn Spanish because they are lazy, stupid, and do not produce enough economic output to make the oligarchs happy.
After snark like yours, is there any doubt why many Republicans are against amnesty, open borders, and comprehensive immigration reform.
@superdestroyer:
So little logic, so much fear and hate.
You’re a sad little person.
@al-Ameda:
The problem is that many Latino voters have relatives that are not US citizens. In fact, the real problem is that these Latinos are not people like Gisele Bundchen or Sofia Vergara, they are, you know, people with Dark Skin.
@superdestroyer:
Funny, kids have been learn other languages for centuries in this country (Latin, French, Spanish, etc) not because they are dumb but because the adults in their lives want them to be smarter. Have you ever seen historical school books? Learning a new language as part of your education isn’t a new thing by any stretch of the imagination.
Fact is, if you deliberately choose to not learn something, you are actively choosing ignorance. You choose to remain provincial for no reason other than oldschool obstinate leanings. I had a student lose out on a fantastic 6 figure job they were well-qualified for… except it required fluent French due to the companies’ international base. She raged that it wasn’t fair, that she was being cheated somehow, she could have hired a translator if it came down it. She wasn’t what the market wanted, so she didn’t succeed. Period. No paycheck for her because she’d rather go out and party rather then take an extra language course.
If they don’t want to hear that their choices can negatively affect their careers, then they deserve what happens. If they don’t want to take extra course work because it’s too hard, then yeah they are kinda lazy. If they don’t want to do what’s needed to get ahead in life, then they don’t get to complain about being left behind or getting passed over for a promotion. Capitalism in action – they’re simply not the best product on the market because they choose to be the base model rather then the updated set.
@superdestroyer:
1-) There are MANY jobs all over the world where you have to learn another language.
2-) There are plenty of jobs for monolingual people in California.
@C. Clavin:
Indeed, me thinks someone needs to simply change the channel. Or at worst, leave the house and see the world.
I had fun learning French, what little I learned in three years of school. I’m a fool not to have taken Spanish. I’m a Texan by birth.
Take a phrase such as “l’esprit de l’escalier”, which says so much in so few words.
Or Greek and Latin roots…
@Janis Gore:
took French and Spanish, and still a Texan.
The spirit of the staircase(l’esprit de l’escalier) is odd to say the least, since most of these neanderthals have missed the first step.
I read all those Spanish instructions and compare them to the English to pick up a word here and there.
But then I’ll read just about anything except for bad pornography and Breitbart.
House Republicans Are Dooming Their 2016 Nominee With Latino Voters
Doug there is no such thing as Latino Voters. Latino is only a language, the language spoken by the Romans (Lingua Latina) and the language that they imposed upon the Spaniards when they colonized what they called Hispania (In Latin) And Latino is not a Race and not an Ethnicity and it doesn’t have anything to do with speaking Spanish or coming from Latin America. We identify people by their races: White,Black,Asian etc. and not by the origin or their languages, Hispanics are using Latino the wrong way because they have no knowledge of what it really means. Latino is a linguistic designation and cannot be used as a Race or Ethnicity indicator.
As for the Republicans the don’t need the ever demanding Hispanics who by the way have already caused White Flight from all of our Cities and Towns. What Republicans need to do is reach out to those stupid Whites who are still in the NOW anti-White, anti-American Democratic Party and bring them to their conservative movement, let them understand that their future is not in the Democratic Party of today. Remember 39% of White liberals voted twice for Obama and this is why he won. If we can get most of them into the conservative movement the Republicans have no problems in winning back the Presidency for at least two or three terms( Mitt Romney lost by 3-4%, not a lot) and in the interim if Congress goes back into republican majority on both Houses then they have to seriously consider repealing the 1965 Immigration Act and stop all non-White immigration. If they don’t do this then in the not too distant future the United States will fall into the wrong hands of the hateful and destructive minorities and it’s not going to be pretty for Whites. God forbid.
@Al Rex:
Seriously, what planet do you live on. To think the GOP can purify the country is not only wrong, but seriously wrong headed. This country was built for the simple reason of freedom for all. It didn’t matter where you came from. Or am I interpreting my History wrong?
@Janis Gore:
Indeed!
@Al Rex:
Awesome comment.
Seriously…well thought out and argued.
Just one question: how will you make that 39% of America suddenly turn stupid?
@Greg: @Greg: @Greg: @Greg: @Greg:
Wrong!!! You must be too young to know how the United States was up to 50 years ago. Almost all White with the exception of the Red Skin Indians and the Black descendants of slaves. Then in 1965 Whites in Congress lost their minds and passed the immigration Act which basically opened up this Country to massive, unchecked non-White immigration. What a mistake.
@Al Rex:
We identify people by their races: White,Black,Asian etc. and not by the origin or their languages
Then why do we call them Arabs? Hmmm.
Hispanics are using Latino the wrong way because they have no knowledge of what it really means.
And I’m sure they appreciate you educating them on the topic of their identity.
Remember 39% of White liberals voted twice for Obama and this is why he won. If we can get most of them into the conservative movement the Republicans have no problems in winning back the Presidency for at least two or three terms
As a white liberal, I’m spotting some serious flaws with your outreach program. Go back to Stormfront, scumbag.
@C. Clavin: They are stupid because they voted for Obama and against their own interests.
@Al Rex:
Funny…I’m white…and I’m far better off than I was in January of ’09.
Actually…most of America is. Freer. Richer. Safer.
Guess it just sucks to be you.
@Al Rex:
OK. Passed an immigration act. Is this wrong? (and FYI, I’m not that young).
You seem to believe we must purify our country to a more white population. OK, fine, but with this comes a reality of ‘that’s not really going to happen’ (which you just don’t see). If you don’t see this, or cant accept it, you live in an alternative reality. Get used to it, and move on, or feel free to take your Bull$hit to your own island where you can have blond hair and blue eyes all day long.
@mantis: Who among us will stand up for me and quote the current minority percentages in this country for the visiting gentleman. Ahem, break out women of all colors as a separate group, please.
My patience is shot. I’m packing for a faggot funeral.
It’s nice that Sooperdooper and Florack have someone new to play with.
@C. Clavin: Where’s he from? Nebraska?
@Al Rex: How y’all feel about Jewish folk, Mr. Rex?
@Greg: The fact is that millions of other Whites think like me. Is just that those who come here now are destructive and don’t have anything in common with us to form a bond of friendship and cooperation . It looks like that every group is against the other group. Blacks don’t like Whites,Hispanics don’t like Blacks, Chines don’t like these ones and the other ones don’t like the others and so on and so forth and all of the others hate Whites for one reason or another so Whites have no alternative other than keep moving. In fact they’ve abandoning all the major Cities and Towns just to get away from all the crime, immorality of others and just the alienation that they feel being around people who don’t like them. I wish that we all could get along but the reality out there is so clear that it cannot pass unobserved.
You say to get used to the changes. Millions of other Whites during the past 50 years have tried but it just is not the same as living in an all White community as it used to be where you didn’t have to worry if a person liked you for being White or not, because we were all Whites, or being afraid of become a victim of crime or seeing all drug dealers hanging around the corners and all these young non-White teenager girls with all these illegitimate children and on welfare and doing nothing constructive and noise and more noise and loud talking and just plain despair all over. No, we will not be able to live together as a family because of the past and because there are insurmountable moral, cultural differences. Nothing to do with race though. Just that people come here and don’t become “Americans” and adopt our European-based values, morals and culture and we will not lower to their level. This is basically what is keeping us apart and this is why those Republicans in Congress are stopping those Hispanic illegal people from entering. We only want beautiful,law-abiding,hard working,moral, educated people. We have enough low-class,welfare dependent and criminals here. Have a Good day.
Well…that was…interesting.
@Janis Gore: I do believe that Jews are good people. They are constructive, hard working and adhere to a certain morality, There is basically no distinction in behavior between White non-Jews and Jews. Religion wise I believe that their religion doesn’t make any sense about God having done this and that as nobody really saw God, I do believe that Christianity makes more sense than any other Religions because it foresees brotherhood, love and forgiveness The only thing that I might disagree with them is the fact that they are too liberal and are for massive immigration which is not really good for them anyway because most of the third world is not only against Caucasian Whites but it’s also against Jews so why would they want to be for open borders. Basically this is what I thing about Jew in nutshell..
Is there anyone who actually thinks the GOP will get significant Latino votes if they jump on the amnesty train? I really don’t think so.
Also, African Americans are probably more harmed by illegal immigration than whites. The unemployment rates for young African Americans is higher than any other group right now. Adding millions of low skilled immigrants who drive the wages down does nothing to help this group.
Oh my! A local klan member has arrived.
I’m not sure what to say here other than, when your ilk dies, maybe so does your way of thinking. I can wait 20 years! And will enjoy my retirement in peace instead of trying to relive the 1850’s.
You sir, are an IDIOT!
@mantis: “So Obama is the evil genius with mind control powers today. Tomorrow he’ll be the incompetent buffoon.”
Dude, it’s Tuesday. Get with the program.
Oh, sh*t! One of them, again.
@Al Rex: “Remember 39% of White liberals voted twice for Obama and this is why he won. If we can get most of them into the conservative movement the Republicans have no problems in winning back the Presidency for at least two or three terms”
I’m a white liberal, and there is nothing in the world that could convince me to vote for any politician who espoused your racist filth. I have absolutely no problem — no fear, unlike you — of living in an increasingly multicultural nation, and am in fact pretty sure we’ll all be better off for it.
Even those who are currently terrified of anyone who doesn’t look and sound exactly like them.
@Janis Gore:
No…the 1800’s.
@Just Me: Actually, I’m interested in seeing a discussion that takes all these factors into account. That’s not what’s happening currently. Too many rexes around:
http://www.amazon.com/Toy-Story-3-Rex-Dinosaur/dp/B00261JT94/ref=sr_1_1?s=toys-and-games&ie=UTF8&qid=1407286888&sr=1-1&keywords=rex+the+dinosaur+toy+story
@Al Rex:
Wow…so open minded about Jews. I was wrong…you’re clearly no bigot.
@C. Clavin:
What is more logical: that the more conservative party will ever be able to appeal to Latinos or that the U.S. will be a one party state where middle class whites have almost no influence on policy or governance and politics is a fight over entitlements and who pays for them.
@Al Rex:
FTFY. You’re welcome.
@superdestroyer:
Exactly the same way it was when their first languages were Erse, Polish, Yiddish, Russian, German, Italian, Swedish, Norwegian, Gaelic, and French. Twenty-seven threads, and you still haven’t responded coherently to this point.
@superdestroyer: How many times do I have to remind you that I’m a middle-class white, SD?
I just know Matt is putting me on.
@C. Clavin: Thanks.
I’m a retire now. A few long days ahead. Send donations to your local humane society. We need all the help we can get.
Animal control is serious business these days.
@Al Rex:
And yet, you are a hateful bigot. Why?
(You do realize, do you not, that the majority of Christians are not “White”? That the founders of Christianity were not “White”? That nobody you would recognize as “White” became a Christian until maybe the fourth century?)
@DrDaveT: The Romans who were Whites adopted Christianity 2000 years ago and then they spread it around. They were instrumental in the advent and development of Christianity. I’m not a bigot. I share the concerns of the majority of other Whites whose lives have been changed by having allowed millions and millions of people within us who don’t have anything in common with us and are changing our social order and threatening our survival as a distinct people.
I do practice what I preach, actually. I am generous and friendly with anyone regardless of their background.
Just one parting thought:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=BXCUBVS4kfQ
@Al Rex:
No. In English, Latin is a language. In Spanish, Latino is related to Latin, and that´s what people in Latin America calls what Americans calls Romance Language(What we say, “Língua Latina”. It´s true that “Iberian America” would be more correct than Latin America, but if you know Spanish you´ll know that it´s very similar to Portuguese.
@Al Rex:
Nonsense; they were mostly co-opted locals — which in Biblical times meant near-east and northern Africa. People like St. Augustine, who was a Punic from what is now Algeria. Even in Rome itself, they were not “White” — they were southern Europeans, swarthy and dark.
No? You just think that there is a particular merit in being White? Sonny, you need to do some serious self-examination.
Don’t you dare to presume what the majority of us think. Speak for yourself, and your little community of terrified parochial racists.
I assume you are equally appalled at all of those millions and millions of Irish and Italian and German immigrants that we stupidly allowed to enter the US during its first 200 years, and can see that it was clearly a bad idea that devastated our sense of community and social identity? Or is that different, because they weren’t brown?
Pathetic.
@Al Rex:
Are you really that bigoted and ignorant or are you just trolling?
@ superdestroyer
Wow, it sounds like we could be headed to a one party state. This is pretty alarming, I would like to hear your thoughts…
For some reason America has forgotten who she is. It’s time for a reminder.
Not like the brazen giant of Greek fame,
With conquering limbs astride from land to land;
Here at our sea-washed, sunset gates shall stand
A mighty woman with a torch, whose flame
Is the imprisoned lightning, and her name
Mother of Exiles. From her beacon-hand
Glows world-wide welcome; her mild eyes command
The air-bridged harbor that twin cities frame.
“Keep, ancient lands, your storied pomp!” cries she
With silent lips. “Give me your tired, your poor,
Your huddled masses yearning to breathe free,
The wretched refuse of your teeming shore.
Send these, the homeless, tempest-tost to me,
I lift my lamp beside the golden door!”
@Al Rex: I suspect this of being a gigantic joke inspired by Tom Lehrer’s old song “National Brotherhood Week.”
Please let me be right. It was a great song.
@DrDaveT:
If it was exactly the same way as immigrants were treated 100 years ago then hospitals would not have to keep a long list translators on retainer that are not paid for by Medicaid/Medicare. School teachers would not be forced mid-career to learn another language. Public Sector job announcements would not demand proficiency in second and third languages. Was there a law 100 years ago that required ballots to be printed in multiple languages?
The last thing that progressives are going to support is treating immigrants the same way that they were treated 100 years ago.
@Vast Variety:
Wghen that was originally written, the continent of North America was sparsely populated and the government consumed around 5% of GDP. Now most Americans are stuck in sprawl and traffic every day, government at all levels consumes around 40% of GDP, and the U.S. has had long term unemployment above 6% for a decade.
The retort is why are willing to allow 100 million third world immigrants to come to the US? What are you willing to give up to allow the huddle masses to move to the U.S.? And why is your plan for limiting immigration to the U.S. is to lower the quality of life to the same level of Central American, Western Africa, or the Phillipines?
We should thank Al Rex, SD, and Eric for posting so frankly. They put the thinking of the Republican base out there for all to see. This means that when “establishment” conservatives say that opposition to immigration reform in particular and Obama in general is based on commitment to “limited Government”, lower taxes, the rule of law, etc., we can just call up the internets and refer to these posts.
Estasblishment conservatives would like to refer these posters as the “fringe” but thanks to lots of financing and encouragement from Roger Ailes, Dick Armey, Ted Cruz, etc, the so called “fringe” is really now the mainstream and driving the bus.
@stonetools:
Once again, there is no way that an Establishment Republican can stand in front of crowd of middle class white Republican voters and explain why they should support comprehensive immigration reform. Calling people lazy, stupid, racist, bigots, and headed to the dust bin of history is no way to convince them to support a policy position that adversely affects their quality of life.
Do you really think any Republican has been convinced by the arguments made by progressives.
@superdestroyer:
Sure they could . The National Review lays out the conservative case for Imigration Reform here:
Furthermore, opponents of immigration reform should consider that from 1860 to 1920 about 14 percent of America’s population was foreign-born — compared with 13 percent today. American institutions and traditions aided in the assimilation of immigrants and their descendants in the past. The fast rate of cultural, linguistic, and economic assimilation among today’s immigrants found by Duke University’s Jacob Vigdor indicates that those American institutions and traditions of assimilation are thriving — even for the 11 to 12 million illegal immigrants here….
Such an approach has two benefits. The first is that it drives a wedge between Democratic politicians, who want to liberalize future immigration, and their labor-union supporters, who want to further restrict immigration. The second is that it embraces the most important aspect of America’s traditional immigration system: the principle that this country is willing to accept immigrants who will work.
Increasing immigration levels would be a return to the status quo that reigned for most of our nation’s existence. Rather than opposing this return to normality, conservatives should embrace it and push for deregulation that allows foreign workers to legally migrate here.
.
As to not wanting to be called bigoted, a good way to avoid that is not to make bigoted arguments. All of your arguments have been made, word for word, by bigots earlier in American history. Ever heard of the book The Passing of the Great Race?. A summary:
So, you might want to reconsider making these arguments. Just a suggestion, mate.
@superdestroyer:
Now I see the source of your confusion.
You think Republicans are Conservative, and wish to help the middle class.
The reality is that today Democrats are the most Conservative party…and Republicans have spent the last 30 years doing everything they can to destroy the middle class.
You just need to come to grips with today’s reality.
http://youtu.be/YcBOcwgb4OA
http://youtu.be/E24C4NY0ga8
@stonetools:
You linked to a CAto Article that makes a great case that unlimited immigraton would be a huge benefit for Sheldon Adelson and other cheap labor Republicans. However, there is nothing is what you linked to that makes a case why middle class whites should support open borders and unlimited immigration. It also breezes past all of the costs associated with increased immigration while claiming it would be be great for employers who want to lower their labor costs. Making such a cases in front of middle class whites is just another way of sayng that they are stupid, lazy, and need to be replaced. .
@C. Clavin:
If you look at the bluest areas in the U.S. such as Washington, DC, New York City, San Francisco, Los Angeles, the one thing that is hard to find are middle class whites (the people who actually vote for Republicans). For white to survive in the middle class in places like Boston or Los Angeles they have to give up the idea of having children or grandchildren. That is why the bluest counties in the U.S. have the lowest white birthrates. If the Democrats are conservative, then conservative means giving up on the future and trying to survive in the present.
@superdestroyer:
Heh, I live in the DC metropolitan area and I can tell you there are a LOT of middle class whites in that area. Indeed, they predominate. Does that reassure you?
No middle class whites in New York or San Francisco? Seriously dude?
Interestingly, places with a lot fewer middle class whites might be solidly anti Obama areas like southwest Virginia. Does such evidence change your analysis? ( Not hopeful here).
@superdestroyer:
I agree – go do that.. Stop telling middle-class Whites they’re so stupid we have to protect them from the difficulties of having to learn another language because it might hurt their brains. Stop telling them they’re such “spechul snowflakes” they don’t have to learn new jobs skills mid-career even though that’s what the capitalist market demands. Stop telling them their quality of life is static and that big, scary change never happens. Stop telling them they never have to grow as people and that effort is kinda necessary for life but why bother.
My god, man. You make Whites sound like the most infantile, mentally-stunted, reality-challenged group on the block, the slightly-dim ones who need their hands held during coloring while the rest of the class is actually learning their ABCs. You make them sound utterly incapable of change or growth – like they’ve hit their peak and are done. You make it sound like they can’t take constructive criticism as it will shatter their fragile souls to realize they are not perfect. You make them sound so selfish and pig-headed in their decision making that they refuse to do things solely because it hurts their image of of themselves.
Can you kindly stop projecting your inadequacies and personal issues onto an entire race? Please? Not everyone is like you, you know.
@KM: Well done.
@superdestroyer:
All of that is a result of the Republicans 30 year war on the middle class.
@superdestroyer:
That the United States will be the first polity in modern history in which the group with a plurality of votes and commanding the vast majority of power positions in pretty much every sector of economical and cultural life will be disempowered is rather unlikely, yes.
White middle class people who agree with you might be disempowered, in the political arena, for a while, but that is not the first or last time that happened to that particular group.The New Deal era was not a fun time for you guys, yet you survived somehow without being sent to liberal Gulags.
@superdestroyer: As someone pointed out upstairs, many states had such laws. In fact ,in places as different from each other As Pennsylvania and Texas, there were many towns and communities in which German was the dominant language for about a century (c. 1850-1950). Somehow, the Anglos in those areas survived.
@superdestroyer:
Here is a short explanation: there are 15 million illegal immigrants in this country now. Try as we might, we can’t deport all of them without giving the federal government vast new powers, and spending huge amounts of money. These immigrants live in the shadows, and easily undercut Americans, as employers can pay them a pittance, and not pay any of the taxes they pay when employing Americans. If we legalize them, while forcing them to pay for the expenses of the process and back taxes and wait 10-15 years for citizenship, they and their employers will have to pay by the rules, like the rest of us. In the meanwhile, the Senate legislation that many of my fellow republicans voted for, vastly extends border protections, and contains measures to clampdown on people who keep on employing illegal labor. This is not ideal, but this is the best we can do.
End quote.
@stonetools: Please don’t tell him that in regions outside the South, between 43 and 55 percent of White people vote for Democrats. His head might explode.
@superdestroyer: Oh noes! In SD’s dystopian nightmare, the ultimate effect of all these terrible brown people is that white people might be forced to learn something! And that’s even after they left the fifth grade! Oh, the torture, the cruelty! How can we call ourselves Americans if we learn stuff?
@Al Rex:
Well, the FHA had an explicitly racist policy towards black homeowners that kept them from accessing government-backed loans available to white people of similar circumstances, only because they were black. The crime, immorality, etc. came as a result of a system that shunned them. So white people moved out not because of any issues you list, but because the value of their homes wouldn’t rise with black neighbors. Y’know, because of an explicitly racist policy, not because of any fault in those black people.
Further, I’ve found it’s really damn easy to get along with other people if you treat them with respect. Like, incredibly easy. It’s so easy I don’t understand how others have a hard time with it.
Further, I’ve found it’s really damn easy to get along with other people if you treat them with respect. Like, incredibly easy. It’s so easy I don’t understand how others have a hard time with it.
Yup, you treat human beings like……well human beings, chances are they will return the favor.
Those who place the interests of foreigners ahead of the interests of their own countrymen are traitors.
@Alsonso:
So it take it you’re not pro-Israel? You’re against allowing companies to move factories off-shore? You think we should ignore Ted Cruz’s ex-Canadian self?
Consistency…
@Al Rex:
Thanks, but the inscription, from Emma Lazarus, on the
Statue of Liberty is good enough for me:
Give me your tired, your poor,
Your huddled masses, yearning to breath free,
The wretched refuse of your teeming shore,
Send these, the homeless, tempest-tost to me,
I lift my lamp beside the golden door.